Episode 18: "Jason Shaves Manhattan” (w/ Derek Dennis Herbert!)

''It’s week 3 of Listener Request Month, and at the behest of Patrick Hamilton we are discussing the ninth (and not final) Friday the 13th film, JASON GOES TO HELL: THE FINAL FRIDAY! Joining the queer wolves is Derek Dennis Herbert, the director of the documentary To Hell and Back: The Kane Hodder Story! Mark reluctantly drags himself through the act of merely acknowledging that this movie exists, Michael gets lost in Lenny Kravitz daydreams, and Nay sneaks R-rated movies out of the video store. Plus, in Tea Time we sip on SHIRKERS, NAKED VENGEANCE, MARY POPPINS RETURNS, and… THE BUTTERFLY EFFECT?''

Trivia
Third episode of Listener Request Month. "We're coming to you live tonight from Movie Jail. Because that's the only place you can find tonight's cinematic trainwreck. Movie Jail. It's a jail for movies." Brennan is introduced as the show's producer-slash-trenchcoat wearing vigilante. Patrick Hamilton requested this episode's movie. First mention of Nay's Yays or Nays. Mark confirms that Michael is a really great cook.

Topics brought up during the episode: They're Inside, friend of the show Jeff Nelson, Scream Factory, women-in-prison rape-revenge double feature Naked Vengeance and Vendetta (1986), whoopie pies, Whole Foods whoopie pies, LaCroix, potato leek soup, chicken salad, Steven Spielberg, Ready Player One (movie), Jaws, Close Encounters of the Third Kind, Poltergeist (1982), Duel, Jurassic Park, War of the Worlds (2005), Zoe Kravitz, Zoe Kravitz on having a complex because of who her parents are, Lisa Bonet going from Lenny Kravitz to Jason Momoa, Steven Culp

Tea Time
Nay: got "really really really high" and watched The Butterfly Effect

Michael: Mary Poppins Returns, which he really, genuinely dislikes

Mark: Shirkers (link to articles about the movie), Naked Vengeance

Mark: It's fabulous, it's such a great doc, check it out check it out check it out

Derek: rewatching Twin Peaks: The Return, Lincoln

Shady Summaries
Nay: Speaking of Rebecca, this is the shady summary I used for Rebecca. What a fucking mess. And it's the same one I'm using for this

Michael: A movie so incoherent and sloppy it just secured the 2020 nomination

Mark: The fans asked, and New Line delivered. Finally, a Friday the 13th movie that feels like it was made by people who'd never seen a Friday the 13th movie before

Derek: A Friday the 13th movie for people who don't like Jason. Because it's true. It's sort of true. You have Kane Hodder as Jason, someone like him who everyone's revved up, saying he's the best part of the eighth movie, the seventh movie and all of a sudden you have him in ten seconds of the beginning and the end of this movie

Michael: You know it's interesting that you bring that up. A person who hates Jason the most? Sean Cunningham. He has many times in the past said that he does not like the character of Jason. This is the first movie he came back to produce since the original. So I don't think it's a coincidence, and I hate to put words into his mouth, but he's said that many times in documentaries and stuff, so I think it's fair to say

Quotes
Mark: (to Derek) You've heard the show before, so you roughly know what kind of trash talk happens on our show. All right, so, let's delay until we have to actually introduce the movie we're discussing today. I'm literally doing this because Brennan has a soft spot for this movie and now I'm just gonna fuckin' go all in

Nay: Yes!

Brennan: I'm ready to play devil's advocate today

Mark: UGH. God. All right, here we go

Michael: Good luck

Michael: Oh my God, yes! I love your old choices!

Nay: (The Butterfly Effect) was amazing!

Mark: So deep? So deep.

Nay: Oh my God, I was living for it

Mark: Ah, Ashton...

Nay: Yes

Michael: The Kutch

Nay: Ashton!

Michael: The Kutcher

Mark: The Kutch

Nay: I was, it was so good

Mark: (dudebro voice) The Kutch!

Michael: (dudebro voice) Ashton Kutcher from Dude, Where's My Car?

Mark: Can I ask what sort of coalesced to make this...

Michael: How did this happen?

Mark: Make this situation happen?

Nay: Well, I mean, not much, to be honest

Michael: Marijuana?

Nay: Yeah. I mean it was gonna happen anyway, and then I was like, "I need a break from the film we're about to discuss. Like, lemme watch something I like."

Mark: Oh wow

Nay: Yeah

Mark: I mean, using The Butterfly Effect as a palate cleanser--

Michael: Wait. So many questions

Mark: Screams desperation, screams a level of desperation that I'm like, "I want to hug you." If you weren't across the table I would

Michael: There's so many questions I have, and I'm gonna ask them

Mark: I would be like, "Come to mama, just come here."

Michael: Did you seek out The Butterfly Effect

Nay: No! No.

Michael: Okay, so. You were searching for anything...

Nay: Yes

Michael: Found The Butterfly Effect...

Nay: Yes

Michael: And said, "This is it."

Nay: And I was like, "You know what? I really like that, I wanna watch that."

Michael: How long did you search for a movie?

Nay: Not even that long

Michael: (groan of disappointment) I was hoping you'd say like an hour, The Butterfly Effect was the one that was like, "This is it."

Nay: No, I searched longer on PornHub for the right movie, you know? I'm like, page fifty-eight and I'm like, "Skip five."

Michael: I feel you there

Mark: The Butterfly Effect is on PornHub?

Nay: (chuckles) No.

Dennis: It probably is

Michael: Yeah

Mark: I mean maybe!

Derek: I mean, a lot of movies get uploaded

Michael: There's probably a cut of it up there.

Mark: It's true!

Michael: Is Stifler in that?

Nay: No

Derek: It's probably called something else, though

Mark: It's the "Butt version".

Michael: Amy Smart's in that, right?

Nay: Amy Smart is amazing

Michael: It's so good. Isn't Amy Smart in that?

Mark: Doesn't- in one timeline she's like, "I'm on drugs."

Nay: Yeah!

Michael: Yeah

Mark: And Ashton's like, (dude voice) "Oh my gawd, I'm so sad!"

Nay: Okay, listen.

Michael: (dude voice) "We have to save her!"

Mark: (dude voice) "We have to save her!" I dunno. That's not how he talks

Nay: I hate both of you. I can't stand either of you. This movie is trippy because I think, I don't know about anyone else, but I often think about decisions I've made in my life...

Michael: Yeah

Mark: Sure

Nay: And have wondered what would turn out differently, of course, right, we all do that? But it's, The Butterfly Effect, it's just so striking sometimes to see the difference in Amy Smart's lifetimes, because one, she kills herself when she's a drug addict. One, is like, "Oh, my father didn't molest me, so I'm a college student now." I dunno. There's just like, when I think about the effects of poverty and abuse and trauma, you know, it's just like...

Michael: That movie gets pretty dark

Nay: Yeah!

Michael: It actually really does

Nay: Yeah. So fuck both of you

Mark: I totally feel bad now. I feel really bad

Michael: Forgot about all that

Mark: Nay like...

Nay: (mocking Mark): "Nay needs a hug!"

Mark: Nay's like, (serious voice) "Actually, there's a lot going on in The Butterfly Effect," (normal voice) and I'm like, (sotto voce) "Oh shit. Okay."

Michael: Put us in our place

Mark: Let's just be quiet. Just gonna sit quietly

Nay: Also, Thumper? The roommate getting laid? Fat person getting laid? I feel like when I was young, I was like, "Praise God."

Michael: I need to see this movie

Mark: You're describing entire chunks of the movie that I have no recollection of, so now clearly- I'm like, "Fuck. Do I need to revisit The Butterfly Effect?"

Michael: Yeah, do I need- is there a queer element? Maybe we could do it for the show

Nay: No, no. I won't make y'all do that

Michael: I told Nay today that what I want An Hour With Nay, as a special for the show

Nay: Oh, God

Michael: Where it's just Nay talking for an hour and I'm her studio audience. So you just hear my reactions, nothing else

Nay: I can't

Michael: I would watch the shit out of a talk show with Nay

Mark: I know. I would too, actually

Michael: Yeah

Nay: After you shame my choices

Michael: Hell no

Nay: (mockingly) "Actually I would totally support you and listen!"

Michael: Didn't you say something- wow! She is putting us in our place

Mark: I know, she really is!

Michael: Didn't you say something about her doing a segment called "Yay or Nay"?

Mark: No, it was going to be called "Nay's Yay or Nays"

Michael: (giggling) Yes! That has to happen!

Mark: And it would be like, Nay every week, sort of having her own segment where she's like...

Michael: It would be like Cheers and Jeers

Mark: Yes, exactly. "Yes to this, no to this."

Michael: We have to do this

Nay: Okay, well if y'all listeners want that, I need you to hit me up on Twitter or Instagram and let me know.

Michael: Yes!

Mark: Please do. Nay's Yays or Nays

Nay: Nay's Yays or Nays. I can't

Michael: I'm just gonna find Mark dead in the parking lot later

Mark: Pretty much

Nay: Later?

Michael: Oooh!

Mark: Why are you mad at me? What did I do?

Nay: I'm actually not. Nothing. I'm not!

Mark: Oh my God!

Michael: This is when the show's at its finest

Michael: I hated that fucking movie

Nay: It sounds fucking awful

Michael: It is just so boring

Brennan: (bad cockney accent) What didn't ya like, Michael?

Michael: That. It was a rough movie. It was a movie I really wanted to see over the holidays 'cause it looked joyous and fun, and I've said many times in the past year that I look for that kind of entertainment right now and, uh…

Mark: I just thought it was brave that Meryl dusted off her old Sophie's Choice accent

Michael: Actually, she was my favorite part of the movie

Mark: My problem was that they brought her a bowl to fix and then they never went back for the bowl

Michael: Yeah. I mean, there's just so much going on in the movie, it doesn't make sense

Mark: I felt like Meryl, they were like, "Oh, Meryl's available. Uhhhhh, she'll fix the bowl!" You know? And whatever, and she had one scene

Michael: And sing a song

Derek: Because Rob Marshall had worked with her on Into the Woods

Mark: Right

Derek: And I think he was like, "Hey! We can get her back, we'll get her in here."

Michael: "How do we get her in here?"

Derek: "Ah, she hasn't had a day to prepare, so let's just pull out one of the, you know, trademark..."

Mark: Carrot Top wigs

Derek: "Carrot Top wigs and an Eastern European accent that literally..."

Michael: "And put her in an upside-down room..."

Derek: "Wouldn't be the choice of anyone to do." (bad Eastern European accent) 'Yes, we topsy-turvy!' (normal voice) You do it one time and that was her whole performance, was just the general Eastern European, kind of Romanian Czech republic kind of accent as opposed to- I wanted to love it...

Michael: Same!

Derek: I enjoyed the ride, but looking back...

Michael: Some of the music was great

Derek: It was sort of like a rehashing of the original with no original, it felt like the took the original story and remade it but didn't make it any better

Michael: Well, the other thing I didn't get is, you're gonna put someone with the talent of Lin-Manuel Miranda, and not just his writing talent, you're not going to have him write A song. I don't get it. Why wouldn't you have him write any of the music? I dunno. I'm just like...

Mark: The group I watched it with, we started to feel funny when Emily Blunt got in the bath with the kids

Nay: Ewwww. Gay.

Mark: We were like (groan of discomfort)

Michael: Was Mary Poppins in the original, I haven't seen it, I wanted to watch it. Was she...

Mark: A fascist? A quasi-fascist (unintelligible)

Michael: A talky bitch

Nay: Oh yeah!

Mark: Oh yeah

Michael: She was?

Nay: Yes

Mark: She is not cuddly

Michael: I was like, I totally don't remember that

Nay: She ain't takin' no fuckin' shit from nobody

Mark: No. She's like, "Fuck you, I live in the sky."

Michael: She's not really nice

Nay: No!

Derek: I remember in the original, she says to the parents pretty much the equivalent of, "You're horrible parents..."

Michael:  She's not wrong

Derek: "I'm the one raising your kids. Shape up or I'll leave."

Mark: "I'm practically perfect in every way."?

Derek: Exactly. "Or I'll leave when my job is done."

Michael: Okay. I couldn't remember and wanted to watch the original, but there was no way I was paying twenty-five dollars to buy that, 'cause that's the only way you can watch it right now

Nay: Oh, really?

Michael: Yeah. It's very Disney

Derek: Soon it'll be on Disney's streaming platform

Michael: Which I still won't mention

Derek: Which will be the only place you can watch any Disney movies, soon

Mark: Wow

Nay: Wow

Mark: What a racket

Nay: Fuck that bitch for sure, tho

Michael: So yeah, fuck you Mary Poppins Returns

Mark: Yeah, quasi-fascist

Michael: At least Ben Whishaw's cute

Mark: I am a major Ben Whishaw stan, and if you want to see a great Ben Whishaw performance--

Michael: Of his dreamy hair at the Golden Globes?

Mark: A Very British Scandal, that he won the Golden Globe for?

Michael: I hear that's excellent

Mark: Fanntastic

Michael: I didn't know he was queer

Mark: Yes he is

Brennan: We should have him on the show!

Michael: Absolutely

Mark: (femme voice) Ben, if you're listening….

Michael: We'll have you on right after Lebron James

Mark: Exactly

Mark: (Michael and I) watched Naked Vengeance. Holy. Shit. Holy shit. Naked Vengeance, you guys, if you have not seen Naked Vengeance, TRIGGER WARNING

Michael: Huge

Mark: Huge trigger, trigger warning! I don't even know. Flashing neon?

Michael: Yeah

Mark: But if that's not a deterrent for you, or it somehow makes the movie more attractive to you, you are in for a depraved treat. It is--

Nay: It sounds wonderful

Mark: And I don't like rape-revenge

Michael: Same. But this Vengeance was...

Mark: But the vengeance was really good

Michael: The vengeance was great

Nay: Ooooh. That sounds really great

Michael: Yeah, it's the type of movie...

Mark: This is the type of movie where the lead actress, who played Phyllis on Dallas for like ten years, she sings the theme song

Nay: Oh, fuck

Mark: You know? That's what we're...

Michael: This is the movie we were watching, we were like, Nay would either be appalled that we're watching this, or be like, "Oh fuck yeah."

Mark: We were like, she'd either be mad that we brought her over here to watch this or she'd be like, "We're watching it again!"

Michael: 'This is awesome!'

Mark: Anywho, Naked Vengeance. You've been warned

Michael: And Vendetta

Mark: Vendetta I didn't love

Michael: I mean, I loved the constant kicking. There was a lot of kick-fighting in this movie. Lots of kick-fighting

Mark: Oh my God, it was like big-hair jail, kind of

Michael: Yeah. Women with closets in their prison cell with like various outfits and makeup and (sighs)

Mark: Yeah. It was, suffice to say, not a truthful portrayal of the prison system

Michael: But also, she got her Vendetta on

Mark: She got her vengeance

Michael: It was a really great night, and I still had my dead Christmas tree up

Mark: It was like January sixth, and Michael was like, (as Michael) "I dunno. I guess it'll eventually decompose."

Michael: (as Mark pretending to be him) "I've been writing that script all week, so like, Brian's gonna be mad when he gets back from Paris, but tree's still up."

Mark: I love Dakota Fanning in (War of the Worlds) because she delivered the kind of child performance where it seemed like she had no idea she was in a movie

Michael: Oh my God

Mark: Where you literally are like, "Is she okay?"

Nay: Yeah

Mark: Like Danny Pintauro in Cujo

Michael: Oh my God. I just watched the Who's the Boss E! True Hollywood Story by the way

Mark: Wow

Michael: Thank you. And that was mentioned in there. He was like three when they did that

Nay: Jesus

Michael: Three or four

Mark: All I know is is that performance is very good and it's not acting

Michael: He's great

Mark: He is like, "I was like, 'They told you that dog was gonna eat you.'"

Nay: Right

Michael: It's kind of like Heather O'Rourke in Poltergeist (1982)

Mark: Oh. God

Michael: She gives an all-time performance there and you almost wonder if she knew what she was doing, you know what I mean?

Mark: R.I.P.

Michael: I know

Derek: There's a lot of, it's crazy. Then you get some child actors that you're like, "Good God, Did they cast this movie? Or did they pull them off the street and throw 'em up there?"

Michael: There's a weird thing about child actors, too, where it's like they almost become aware that they're an actor, and you can see them become that. You see that a lot in eighties and nineties sitcoms. Keshia Knight Pulliam is a good example- pulling this out of my ass. She was Emmy-nominated for the first two years of The Cosby Show. As a five and a six-year old. And then you watch her by the time season five or six rolls around and she's like a self-aware preteen, and it's like--

Nay: Oh yeah! 'Cause she got upstaged by Raven Symoné. Like, "You're not the cute baby anymore."

Mark: That's true. Raven Symoné turned up on that show and you know Keshia Knight Pulliam was like, "Oh shit, I'd better up my game."

Nay: Mmm-hmm. They were like, "I don't give a fuck about her no more."

Michael: I wanna see the E! True Hollywood Story of that duel

Nay: Okay?

Mark: Yeah, Rudy, she was like, "Oh shit. Rudy's gonna get into an accident. There's gonna be a very special episode where Rudy's gonna get into an accident and be off the show."

Michael: (as Raven Symoné) "Aw, did you choke on my Teddy Grahams? I'm sorry."

Mark: Yeah, exactly

Nay: Little baby Raven Symoné's like, "I'm gonna be so problematic in the future that no one is ever gonna give a shit about you, girl."

Mark: Olivia's gonna be like, was her name Olivia?

Michael: Yeah, it was. She couldn't even read the scripts when she started on that show because she didn't know how to read. She was three

Nay: Oh my God. And she was just around that rapist all the time. Awful.

Michael: Awful

Mark: That's why I love Lisa Bonet, now and forever

Michael: Always

Mark: Because Lisa Bonet was like, "You're a creep, and I'm gonna get off this show. I'm gonna get my own spin-off. Not only that--"

Michael: "I'm gonna quit it after a year."

Mark: "Not only that, I'm going to violate your cutesy American image. I'm gonna go fuck Mickey Rourke in this other movie, and I'm gonna do a bunch of voodoo shit."

Michael: "And you're still gonna bring me back on the show for a paycheck in season seven.'

Mark: I love that Derek before the show is like, "So, uh, is there anything I can't say on the show?" And I'm just like, "Nooo. No. We're gonna talk about Lenny Kravitz's dong flopping out."

Michael: "Say words like Aquadick."

Mark: We've delayed the inevitable long enough

Michael: I know

Mark: After Jason took Manhattan, or more specifically, a medium-sized passenger ship off the coast of British Columbia, you thought, "Gee! It will never be this bad again. Things can only get better from here, right?" Guess again, motherfuckers! As part of our month of listener picks, Patrick Hamilton. Patrick. Patrick.

Michael: We need to talk about Patrick

Mark: We need to talk about Patrick? Chose Jason Goes to Hell: The Final Friday

Michael: Thank you, Patrick

Mark: To prove to us once and for all, that no, we cannot have nice things. Now before we tear this bitch apart, let's check in with Patrick to find out what on Earth we ever did to him to deserve this. Take it away, Brennan

Brennan: I will say that I love Patrick, first of all. He's an incredible person

Michael: Thank you for donating to The Trevor Project

Mark: I'm sure he's lovely, for a sociopath, he's lovely

Nay: (chuckling) Oh my God!

Brennan: Also, I also love Jason Takes Manhattan but whatever

Patrick Hamilton on why he chose Jason Goes to Hell: The Final Friday: My name is Patrick Hamilton. And as a result of making a donation to The Trevor Project, I was rewarded with the ability to choose a movie for y'all to discuss, and I chose the 1993 epic Jason Goes to Hell. Why? Something's going on here that requires a healthy dose of the Queerwolf theory. So Jason's blown up in the opening minutes of his normal, heteronormative stalking as it were, and spends the rest of the movie sliding his enchanted heartworm down the throats of as many men as he possibly can for the majority of the runtime. A bounty hunter requires that a guy pass his hands through the bars of a jail cell, let him fondle them and then break them in order to get information. And then of course, Jason also strips a guy nude, straps him to a sex harness and shaves his mustache! Is this as deliberate as a Freddy's Revenge or Lost Boys? Or is it just the byproduct of New Line Cinema trying to ripoff Terminator 2?

Michael: I wanna hear a book on tape by Patrick

Nay: Okay??

Michael: I want him to read to me

Michael: He brought a perspective

Nay: I wish Patrick was here, right now

Michael: I do, too. How 'bout you, Mark?

Mark: I mean, I, yeah, I wish I could do this to his face. No, I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I joke.

Michael: I love Mark!

Mark: Patrick, I kid, I kid

Derek: I will say he was a little loose with the word "epic" though. Of all the movies- Jason X, I could see the word "epic" being applied to because of scale, it was an epic scale film. But this one's a little, uh...

Mark: You know what? I agree.

Michael: I want him to read me a book. Patrick

Mark: What book?

Michael: Rebecca

Mark: It always goes back to Rebecca

Mark: I want to start out by saying, you know, shading Patrick and everything, that I appreciate the gusto with which he sort of launched into- and obviously he suggested this tongue-in-cheek

Michael: Very clearly

Mark: Very clearly. So I totally understand that. However, however. The first line of dialogue in this movie is the word, "Shit," which, you know, just feels foreboding for the next hundred minutes. Was it a hundred minutes? It felt like three hun- it felt so long. The nicest thing I can say about this movie, about Jason Goes to Hell, is that in a certain way, you know, it came out in 1993 and in a completely inept way it anticipates the meta horror wave of the nineties, of New Nightmare and Scream because of its inclusion of things like the Necronomicon and the jungle gym that the birds sit on from The Birds, and the crate from Creepshow. So the fact that these things are present point to a kind of playfulness and sense of humor that unfortunately the movie literally cannot seem to do anything with. But it feels, but watching it, I was like, okay, this feels like the opening salvo of where horror...

Michael: Where horror was going to go at the time?

Mark: Where horror was going to go in that decade

Michael: Well I think the opening scene plays into that as well. I look at the opening scene as like a meta moment as well. You have the, you know, bosomy woman alone in a cabin taking a shower and she's doing all the things that you do

Mark: That's her credit, "Bosomy Woman"

Nay: "Bosomy Woman"

Mark: "Bosomy Woman"

Michael: "Bosomy Woman." But they have her live, and it's on purpose, doing all the tropes of a Friday the 13th movie that usually gets female characters killed

Mark: Have you seen, have you guys seen Crystal Lake Memories, the documentary?

Michael: Absolutely

Mark: So I watched the Jason Goes to Hell segment for this, and they actually interview the actress who played...

Michael: Played the FBI agent?

Mark: Right. And she was talking about...

Nay: She fine

Michael: Yeah. Right?

Nay: She fine as hell

Michael: Mmm-hmm

Mark: And I'm quoting her basically, but she was just like, "The director Adam didn't like my hair. And I said, 'Honey, if they're looking at my hair in this scene and not my knockers, then I don't know what to do!'" Or something like that

Michael: Yeah she did

Derek: Knockers

Mark: And I was like, "Wow, you called them knockers."

Michael: Knockers. Knockers

Derek: Maybe she was direct quoting what she said in 1993, though

Mark: She must have been

Michael: She had to have been

Mark: I don't think she got less salty

Derek: I hope she's not stuck in the nineties

Mark: Yeah, exactly

Michael: I think that sequence is actually pretty clever. It's the only good part of the movie. It feels like a Friday the 13th movie in that moment, and then, of course

Mark: They blow up Jason

Michael: Yeah, it's like maybe it should have been a short

Mark: And then they blow up Jason and Sheriff David Clarke is there. Literally Sheriff David Clarke. It's David Clarke. And he's in the woods and I don't understand what's happening. Then he's interviewed on television on like A Current Affair. And then they started doing this thing where he's like, "When you think of Jason Voorhees, what do you think of?"

(Brennan plays the clip of the interview scene from the movie with Creighton Duke answering)

Steven Culp: I'm gonna say some words to you, Mister Duke, and I want you to say the first things that come to your mind, okay?

Creighton Duke: Okay

Steven Culp: You ready?

Creighton Duke: Shoot

Steven Culp: Jason Voorhees

Creighton Duke: Now that makes me think of a little girl in a pink dress, stickin' a hot dog through a donut

Mark: ''What? '''What? Why??' I don't under- what??

Michael: I don't think the filmmakers knew either, 'cause wasn't there some sort of agreement that he would do the movie only if he could dress as a cowboy?

Mark: Yes, that is correct

Michael: What the hell?

Brennan: Is he the Jennifer Coolidge of horror movie bit parts?

Derek: That was a great reference

Michael: That was a real good pull!

Mark: Now if Jennifer Coolidge had played the mercenary

Michael: Had she said that?

Mark: (as Jennifer Coolidge) "Oh, honey, you're gonna..."

Michael: If she said like, (as Jennifer Coolidge) "Pink dress putting a hot dog," I would have been on the fucking ground laughing like, "This movie's a genius!"

Mark: This would've been a very different podcast. I would have been like, "This is the greatest Friday the 13th film ever made."

Michael: They said he was just saying shit on takes

Mark: Yeah

Michael: They had no idea what any of it meant or that any of it was coming, and I guess they were probably like, "Well, we gotta use some of this, because we don't have scenes otherwise."

Mark: I guess

Derek: When talking with Kane about this movie, the biggest thing he kept saying was that he liked the idea of it

Michael: It's an interesting idea

Derek: Yeah. I can't say it's a bad idea, the idea that Jason would go into it. But (Kane) was also the stunt coordinator and he was trying really hard to, he wanted all the actors to be Jason when they got turned

Michael: Right

Derek: He thought it would be a good acting role for them as well

Michael: To do all the nuances and stuff?

Derek: To do all the nuances. Turn the head, do the heavy breathing

Mark: Mmm-hmm

Nay: Yeah

Derek: You know, all that kind of stuff, he thought it could work, but half of them or more didn't want to do that. Like, "Oh, no. Jason in my body would just be me." And it doesn't make a whole lot of sense

Michael: It doesn't

Derek: You have a persona...

Mark: Imagine, imagine me, an actor who is lucky to be cast in a studio film and part of a venerable slasher franchise, and you have the guy who's played Jason three times, who's become the fan favorite, who's literally sort of like, I guess, has quote-unquote perfected the role to a certain degree telling you how to do it and you're like, "Mmm, no. At the Sunshine Do-ray Acting School, I learned that blah blah blah fart noise." I just, wow

Derek: Agreed

Nay: He was like, "No. Jason as a Black man acts like this."

Mark: I don't know

Derek: There are just so many parts- the beginning I really liked. And that ending, it has the cool fight sequence at the end, I don't dislike the ending. But that whole middle is just garbage fire. It's awful

Mark: (defeatedly) Yeah

Michael: It goes from Youngstown to New Jersey...

Derek: To a diner that for some reason Leslie Jordan...

Mark: The guy from Sordid Lives?

Derek: Exactly

Michael: There are some interesting ideas, like the Voorhees burger is another meta moment where we're kind of like...

Derek: And waffles that are cut up like...

Michael: Yeah, it's just like... I dunno, man

Derek: There are so many things in that movie that don't make a whole lot of sense. Because why wouldn't we have known about uh, can I reveal something in the movie?

Michael: Yeah, you can spoil it

Mark: No, please preserve the beautiful secrets of Jason Goes to Hell

Derek: How the fuck didn't we know (Jason) had a sister?

Michael: Right

Derek: In all the other movies, they didn't think to mention, like couldn't they have just thrown a line in like- but they couldn't, because in the first movie and the second movie, you know, especially the first one with the mom, she would have had to have said something along the lines of, "Well, your sister…" or something. But no, she doesn't, so it sort of becomes the Jurassic World: Fallen Kingdom of the franchise

Mark: Woof

Derek: Where all of the sudden you have a character that you should've heard of in the first movie or second, and other than a brief reference, well in that franchise is a brief reference like, "Myself and some business partners," in the first couple movies and then we're to assume he has another business partner

Mark: Exactly

Derek: But in this one, they didn't mention anything! They didn't say anything about a sister and I feel like that was a huge way for them to be like, "Oh, we're gonna do what they did in Halloween! We're gonna make up that he had a sister then too."

Michael: People actually have given Scream 4 a little bit of grief in the past for Sidney having a cousin that she never mentioned before and I'm like, "When is she going to mention her cousin during any of this?"

Derek: Listen. Cousin is understandable.

Michael: Yes

Derek: But a sibling, you'd think that the mother would reference

Mark: Over the course of eight movies...

Michael: It could just be a long lost family member or, you know what I mean?

Derek: Exactly. A Voorhees...

Michael: Look. Jason Goes to Hell is the junk drawer of slasher movies. It's just like, what, I dunno. A tape dispenser, old gum, whatever. It's all in there

Mark: Around forty-five minutes into this movie I just wrote, "I wanna die." These are other things I wrote in my notebook while I was watching: "Why is this happening?" "Why make these choices?" "I'm so angry." And then there are just variations on "What?"

Michael: "Who?"

Mark: "Why?" "Huh?" And ,"Uch." That's literally- like I am usually very, I try to take a lot of detailed notes for the things we cover and I was just like, "You win, Jason Goes to Hell. You win." I don't, I don't know what to say

Michael: I just love when the coroner takes a bite out of the heart. Just like, "Huh?"

Derek: Yeah, I always thought--

Michael: He's supposed to be hypnotized by the heart, apparently?

Derek: Yeah, I always thought that it made sense. In previous watchings, I didn't question it as much. First of all I didn't remember it had any queer themes until you guys were like, "There are plenty of queer themes in it." And I was like, maybe I didn't watch this movie clear enough. There were definitely some, many of them there. But I did not remember how weird--

Mark: Are there?

Derek: Well, it's debatable. It's debatable

Michael: Yeah, I don't find it to be a queer movie in that way

Derek: There are many things in the movie

Mark: Some do, though

Derek: I mean, when I googled it just to see what people were also talking about before I watched it- this is on the list, not the top three, but it's in the top ten homoerotic horror films of a lot of lists

Mark: Who are these homosexuals?

Michael: It's only because of the shaving scene?

Derek: That scene, plus the fact that of all the decisions they could have made, Jason only goes to other men until the baby and the girl? But he goes into a lot of men before women

Michael: Yeah

Derek: But still, that to my opinion was Jason is a male, he might wanna remain a male while he's on a quest y'know

Michael: Watching this movie made me think, leaning to embrace bad films...

Mark: I just, I just, I dunno. Listen, no disrespect to anyone who watches Jason Goes to Hell and is like, "Oh, I detect queer themes!" Myself, watching rando guys try to slip each other a turdworm, I don't watch that and go, (fey voice) "Representation!" (normal voice) I'm like, I'm sorry, I'm just like, I don't know, I don't know what to say. I mean...

Michael: Well there's a lot of just because Jason's in other people's bodies too, why does he start doing things that he doesn't do. Like shaving somebody. Why? Why? Why is he doing that?

Derek: Yeah, what purpose does that serve him?

Mark: If he'd shaved his ass, maybe homoerotic. But you know what?

Michael: Or his taint

Mark: Or his taint. Then I would have been like, "All right, Jason Goes to Hell. Jason Shaves Manhattan."

Michael: Nay, what do you think?

Nay: I wanted to see it so bad when I was younger because I saw the cover of it in Blockbuster

Michael: Me too!

Mark: With the worm thing coming out?

Nay: Yes

Michael: And "The Final Friday" on it, it says? Yeah

Nay: And I was like, "That- Hell is in the name, that must be such a bad movie. I wanna see it so bad."

Mark: "A bad kid movie!"

Nay: Yeah, you know, exactly. Bad kid movie

Mark: "Bad kids watch this!"

Nay: And I remember walking by it with my mom being like, "Oh, that's the devil." 'Cause my mom, she was like--

Michael: DAB?

Nay: Yeah, DAB. You know

Michael: God bless DAB

Nay: She was like, "That's the devil." And I was like, "Clearly. It looks like the devil."

Mark: "And you can get the devil for three nights at Blockbuster! Plus a tub of popcorn and a Diet Coke!"

Michael: Awww, I miss Hollywood Video

Mark: I know

Nay: So yeah, I was dying to see it. I remember, you know I don't remember liking it as much as I liked Halloween when I was younger. I feel like Halloween was my everything. But I felt so cool for having seen it. And I liked to tell my friends, "You know that cover the youth pastor brought up last week for..."

Michael: Oh my God

Nay: You know, I'd be like, (whispers) "I saw that." Yeah

Michael: And what would they say?

Nay: Oh, bad kid behavior, you know?

Mark: Did they tell on you?

Nay: No

Michael: That's good.

Mark: How did you sneak it? How did you finally sneak it?

Nay: Because the thing is, those kids were doing all kinds of wild shit. Christian school kids are wild as fuck

Michael: Mmm-hmm

Mark: Yeah

Nay: And I was sneaking movies, but I wasn't doing the shit they were doing

Mark: Oh yeah, no

Nay: And so like, yeah, 'You could tell on me for that, but like--'

Mark: Oh, no. Cigarettes and handjobs. Yeah

Nay: "You like fucked your cousin."

Mark: Christian kids are...

Michael: Oh my God!

Nay: "There's other like..."

Michael: You're like, "Oh my God, ew! Ya cousin fucker."

Nay: Oh, but how did I sneak it?

Mark: Yeah

Nay: 'Cause I looked like a grown-ass woman at that age. I looked old as hell. I was such a big fucking kid.

(Everyone laughs hard)

Mark:  I just was not expecting that!

Nay: I used to sneak all kinds of things 'cause people thought I was old. I would stay in the pool during adult time. Like, because, nobody thought my five-foot ten ass was a child

Mark: You were really tall from an early age

Nay: Yeah. I've been this tall for a long time, and so...

Mark: Ugh, see

Michael: (while laughing) Stayed in the pool at adult time

Nay: Hell yeah! You ain't gonna question me. Who gonna check me, boo? Honestly, I was like, so tall. And you know with Black people they're like, "She could be nine, she could be fifty-five, like I don't know."

Michael: (while laughing) This is why I want Nay hour!

Nay: So yeah. Rented that.

Mark: That is an incredible advantage of a certain age in the video store

Nay: Yeah. Yeah. There are times when it's an advantage...

Mark: Oh my God!

Nay: Sometimes you're like, "Oh my God of course I'm annoying everyone. I'm eleven. Let me be a child." And then other times you're like...

Mark: Did you find yourself getting disciplined or treated...

Nay: Yes!

Mark: Or expected to be old, or behave- I think you know the question I'm about to ask

Nay: There's a lot of articles, actually, on how tall children get treated versus just smaller, petite children

Michael: I don't know why I just flashed on that 30 Rock where Liz Lemon thinks she's talking to Oprah the whole flight and it just ends up being a very tall twelve-year-old girl

Nay: I think that probably happened to me by a lot of white women on drugs when I was a kid. They saw me as an older Black woman

Michael: Nay's Yay or Nays, I need it now. Spin-off show? Seriously

Mark: It's just it's own show!

Michael: Nine to fifty-five should be the title

Nay: (To Mark) Are you crying?

Mark: A little bit!

Michael: Instead of Nine to Five, Nine to Fifty-five should be the title

Nay: Oh my God, you're awful

Michael: I love when Mark gets super super super happy laughy

Mark: Listen, okay, I mean this movie just from the get-go, it just has me punchy as fuck

Michael: Oh that's right, we're talking about that movie

Mark: I know, remember we have to talk about Jason Goes to Hell. Anyway.

Mark: So we talked about the deeply homoerotic shaving scene, which (sarcastically) oooooh, so sexy!

Michael: Derek, what were you gonna say?

Derek: Truthfully, that's one of the things I was gonna say is, I didn't really see any of the stuff that had been brought up.

Mark: Yeah

Derek: They're quick to call it that, but I think a lot of the times, it's just when you do things that you would normally do with women, it's sort of the Friday the 13th Part  no, Nightmare on Elm Street Part 2 issue. I mean that movie has- when all subtext lies, when the acting goes homoerotic. The dialogue, the special effects, everything? It doesn't become as subtle any more. But with this one I feel like it could've just been a case of, "Jason was doing things to guys that he usually did to women." So he would usually, and I don't think he would normally tie anyone up. That's one of the things...

Michael: He would never shave anyone

Derek: He would never tie and shave up anyone. I feel like if he had...

Mark: Or barf up a turdworm

Derek: Exactly. That's the thing. I don't understand that transfer. I think that could've been done very differently, too. Like why did it have to be a big warty tongue? Couldn't it have been like a...

Michael: A touch?

Mark: Anything

Derek: Exactly. I dunno.

Mark: Anything else

Derek: He cuts them with a machete and then like--

Mark: Finger them. Then I'll be like, "It's homoerotic."

Nay: Yes!

Mark: Do you know what I mean? I dunno

Michael: Finger their- I'm not even gonna say it

Mark: Okay, I do wanna talk about the one sequence in the movie that feels like it's from a Friday the 13th movie. Which is not the opening, but at the midpoint, which apparently was done during reshoots because the movie did not feel anything like a Friday the 13th movie that fans would be expecting and so they did this reshoot with this guy and Michelle Clunie from Queer as Folk, and another woman.

Halfway through the movie these people show up and they think Jason is dead, they're hitchhiking to go to Camp Crystal Lake to get it on, to do drugs and get it on, because now they're not gonna die

Michael: It wasn't that

Mark: And I just wanna know. They were like, "Oh, let's add this in." What I wrote was, and I went until I had a rage stroke. I was like, "Who are these kinky weirdos that dragged their single friend along to make her listen to their fucking all night. Why would they hitchhike in the dark, only to fuck at the site of what is arguably, in the film, the worst continuous mass murder in 20th century American history. Who are these fucking people. Moreover, who is the sad girl riding shotgun, who's just ready to fuck the guy who picks them up and then is sad when he doesn't try to grope her ten seconds after she gets into the car. What's- why?' Even for a Friday the 13th movie, this was a whole other level." And I say this as a die-hard fan of Friday the 13th movies. This was like, "Holy shit."

Michael: Well there's a lot of like...

Mark: Who's driving the car?

Michael: There's a lot of fantasy, right? Like that's gotta be straight male fantasy. Just like how every time there's- I think I've mentioned this before, I've read several scripts in the last year or two where every time there was a lesbian character, she got, she wasn't lesbian by the end of the movie 'cause she fucked a dude, y'know?

Mark: Well that's the cure

Michael: Right. There's this...

Mark: I mean, that's real. That's just real

Michael: There's like this weird putting on a fantasy in the film that you wish happened to you, I'm betting, you know what I mean?

Nay: Oh, God

Derek: It did feel really weird, 'cause it feels like they- why would a single, why did she, why would she tag along?

Mark: "Oh, so I can hear you two bone all night? Oh my God, where's my backpack?"

Nay: Sometimes, sometimes that sounds cute. I actually was thinking that

Mark: Nay's like, "Actually…"

Nay: Listen. I was thinking when I was watching this and then I was like, "How can I say this out loud and not sound disgusting?"

Michael: Free ride?

Nay: Whatever! So if my friends go over to this tent six feet away to fuck, I'm thinking obviously so you're probably okay with me masturbating out here

Michael: True!

Nay: But then I was like, no, I can't assume someone's okay with that. That's the part that made me disgusted

Mark: Although where would they- they wouldn't have a leg to stand on if they got out of the tent, saw you masturbating and were scandalized

Nay: I'm like, "I'm right here!"

Mark: You'd be like, 'Really?"

Michael: "You brought me."

Mark: "You brought me. You knew what was gonna happen!"

Michael: So what's the pitch here? "Okay, Amber. Josh and I are gonna go fuck in the woods, but we're gonna hitchhike there. We don't have a car! We're gonna rely on some random stranger to go," and she's like, "I am so in."

Mark: "I know it's midnight. It's already midnight."

Michael: "And it's at Camp Crystal Lake." And she's like, "So in."

Nay: So I was thinking the only way I would want to be the third wheel is if it was a couple I wanted to listen to fuck

Michael: True

Nay: Listen to them fucking, you know

Michael: I wasn't mad at him

Derek: Why would you bring more than one? Like if you were doing that, you know, as someone who's gone on trips with people who were you know...

Mark: Not to hear them copulate, yeah, go on

Derek: I would have my own tent and at a certain point...

Mark: I know! She was just like...

Michael: On the ground!

Derek: She literally was asked by the girl who's in the couple, "Hey, do you mind if we take the tent for an hour?"

Mark: I know!

Michael: She should have had a giant sack of dildos

Derek: You should've brought your own

Michael: "Yeah, I brought a sack of dildos. I'll be in the woods."

Nay: "Yeah, you keepin' that tent, you keepin' that tent. That's your tent all night, okay?"

Derek: That's what she said! "It's your tent all night, I'm gonna sleep out here. It's a beautiful night."

Mark: That tent's gonna be funky and it's fine. Whatever. But I guess the plan, I'm realizing now, maybe the plan was they were like, "Amber. We're hitchhiking to Camp Crystal Lake--"

Michael: "And the hitchhiker's gonna be hot!"

Mark: "To bone." And she's like, "But I'm single right now and I feel weird." And they're like, "Don't worry--"

Michael: "We'll find someone"

Mark: "You can fuck the stranger with the car."

Michael: "That we hitch a ride from"

Mark: And she's like, "Of course!"

Nay: "Duh!"

Mark: "Where's my backpack? Let's go."

Michael: She actually has one on already. "I'm ready! You had me at hitchhike."

Nay: I can never be shamed by someone calling me out for being on my phone. I'm proud, I'm proud

Michael: I know. On today's playback, you were like, "I started Hill House, but I realized I was on my phone an hour later."

Nay: Yes

Michael: I wanted to bring up those two problematic issues with the...

Mark: Here's the thing. I wanted to lead into that, because...

Michael: Okay great

Mark: I think, maybe I'm being too sensitive...

Michael: (unintelligible)

Mark: Maybe I'm being too sensitive, but I can see how people can read homoerotic themes into the film. However, the weird leather straps and the, and not like sexy leather just the weird leather straps

Nay: (sotto voce) It's like a little sexy

Mark: (sotto voce) Is it? Well, okay. To each their own

Nay: Maybe not in the movie, but I felt inspired

Mark: Fair enough

Michael: Inspiration's always a good thing

Mark: I think the turdworm kissing--

Nay: Hmmm, that killed it for ya

Mark: Yeah. I just felt like, I felt like it was an opportunity--

Michael: (amused) Turdworm

Mark: I felt like it was an opportunity for the audience to be like, "Ew, guys kissing!"

Nay: Yeah

Mark: And so to me I feel like it's more homophobic than anything. I don't get- just because Jason shaves a guy

Michael: Right. That's not queer

Mark: It's not. And the movie manages to double down by being apparently pretty misogynistic as well. And look, I'm not against body horror by any stretch of the imagination. I think that some of my favorite horror is body horror. But, I think when the characters are so thinly drawn and so cheap when you show one of the turdworms flying up the skirt of the...

Michael: Of his sister's, the sister character

Mark: The poor, poor actress, who apparently had no idea that this was going to happen in the movie

Michael: Yep. She wasn't present for that

Mark: That's just super gross

Nay: Oh, it was a stunt double?

Michael: It was a stunt double, but they didn't tell her that was going to happen to her character. So essentially the turdworm...

Mark: The turdworm didn't want to do it either

Michael: Crawls up into her skirt and into her vagina

Mark: The turdworm wouldn't come out of his trailer

Derek: And is born a full-size Kane Hodder Jason

Michael: Yes

Mark: Yes

Michael: And she was never made aware, it was never in the script, she was never made aware that that was gonna happen. She didn't know they'd hired a body double to play her, and she didn't know about it until she saw it onscreen

Mark: Gross

Michael: That's disgusting. If you think about it, she- I have this article up that I found while doing research called "Thirteen Things You May Not Have Known About Jason Goes to Hell" and this was one of 'em. Do you want me to read? It's a brief kind of summary. There's two very problematic things with women in the movie. "Erin Grey didn't know the following happened to her character until she saw it with everyone else at the premiere. It was never in the script and Grey did not pose for that scene specifically where the--" turd monster, is that what you called it?

Mark: Turdworm

Michael: Turdworm crawls into her vagina. "And according to the director," and this is where I get a little pissy, "He says that was a corporate decision to make the story elements kind of link up easier. 'I admit it's a little distasteful and I regret the shot even though, trust me. Audiences love it.'" A reluctant kind of blame...

Mark: They love it 'cause they know the movie's almost over

Michael: And also, I don't like the type of statement where you try to push the blame onto somebody else while also kind of being a little bit arrogant about it

Nay: Right

Michael: You know, it's just like, I think a better statement could have been, "I was twenty-three years old and I made a really stupid mistake." But, you know, I, so...

Mark: And then apologizing badly

Michael: Imagine that

Michael: Also, to bring up another problem is, Kerri Keegan who played the daughter of this character actually walked off the set and only returned when director Adam Marcus was removed and Sean Cunningham was inserted as director for the final days of the filming. And this is a longer story, but basically it went down to she had to do a shower scene. I don't think she had a "no nudity" clause in her contract, but they agreed no nudity. And he insisted she do nudity, and even went as far as, according to Kerri herself, Adam Marcus denies this, but Kerri says that he was going around telling people, "I'll get her to do it," to the point where she walked off set and refused to return until he was gone. And they actually replaced him, so she finished the movie. So there's, you know, I like, reading those kind of things...

Mark: Yeah

Michael: Any sort of queerness that may be there isn't on purpose--

Mark: Yeah

Michael: Because I don't think a person who does those kind of things to your actors has a queer wink in them

Mark: No. Not in the way we'd like to see a queer wink

Michael: Right

Mark: I've hung out with Michelle Clunie before, who played I think Debra, the camper who, from the tent. And she went on to do Queer as Folk

Michael: Good for her!

Mark: Yeah, good for her. And she's a lovely person. And I remember Jason Goes to Hell: The Final Friday came up twice. But the first time it did, I remember 'cause it was running on HBO and I'd never seen it and I saw it and I called her and I was like, "I saw- Guess what I just saw? I saw you in this scene, blah blah blah." And she made a noise like, (disappointed sigh)

Michael: She's like (as Michelle) "I thought we were friends, Mark!"

Mark: It was like as though--

Michael: Like she'd been hurt

Mark: Yeah, no. As though I had been like, "I know you did that hit-and-run." And she was like this heavy (disappointed sigh)

Mark: What are some of the chestnut factoids about Jason Goes to Hell that we can leave--

Michael: Like a better taste in their mouth?

Mark: Like a rotten mint on a pillow for our listeners

Michael: Okay, so, it was supposed to be Freddy Vs. Jason. I'm sure people knew that.

Derek: Yeah, or right after that, if not

Michael: The script was written in four days

Mark: (feigning shock) No!

Michael: Shocking

Mark: What?!

Michael: Yeah. Let's see there's one, two, three, four, four people involved in the writing process

Mark: Oh those poor people

Michael: Steven Williams would only play Creighton Duke if he could dress as a cowboy, which I already mentioned

Mark: What I wanna know is- Here's what I wanna know: What the fuck were the other options that they were like, "Oh fuck, we really have to let him wear a cowboy hat otherwise we're gonna have to go with the other guy." I'm just like- because he's not good, in the movie. He's not good. He has the weirdest delivery. I just, he doesn't make the character work on any level.

Derek: Yeah, that whole breaking the fingers scene

Mark: The breaking the fingers! Why?

Derek: He just breaks it and is like, "It's gonna cost ya, every time, it's gonna cost ya." And then at the end, when he sees the hand all mangled he's like, "This one's free." Like after making a whole deal like this where it's gonna cost you a whole lot more, now it's free

Mark: What for? What for? Oh God, it makes me so angry to think about it

Michael: Maybe a little bit better thing for the director, but apparently he had a reason there's a lot of male nudity in the film is he said that for every female that they showed nude, he required they show a male nude, so it was kind of even

Derek: That's a cool concept, at least. I guess

Michael: At least he was thinkin'. It was originally filmed at twenty-two frames per second

Derek: Why?

Brennan: He's Peter Jackson-ing it

Mark: Because Sean Cunningham famously has an issue- he shot DeepStar Six this way because he always thinks that actors are taking too long to emote, and so he wants them to hurry the fuck up

Michael: Yeah, he actually wants them- yeah

Mark: Which is just like, okay? I guess?

Michael: As a writer...

Mark: And so yeah

Michael: They're too busy emoting

Derek: At twenty-two frames per second, it sounds like he's trying to save money on two frames a second, which does not add up to a lot

Mark: No, not really!

Derek: Especially- I mean it's not like they're shooting again Lord of the Rings and Lord of the Rings they were shooting on sixty frames a second, so it was the opposite. They were trying to, they were actually wanting to use more

Mark: Well, as shocking as it is--

Michael: He didn't like how long it took people to walk through a door

Mark: Yeah. As shocking as it is that there's this many differences between the making of Jason Goes to Hell and Lord of the Rings, but you know, hey

Michael: Amazing

Mark: Who knew?

Derek: Peter Jackson came from low-budget horror too, though

Mark: Oh my God, and it's the best

Michael: Yeah

Mark: We need to do Dead Alive one day

Michael: So those were some of the funner ones

Mark: Oh, the funner. (mocking) "Those were the ones that were funner."

Michael: (mocking) "Those were the ones that were fun."

Derek: A lot of the movies (Kane) is in, while the movies themselves are not always amazing films, he's always good in them.

Mark: Right

Derek: You could watch something that looks twenty times worse than something The Asylum could make and Kane is a big character in it. Kane, you could take that same performance and drop it in, you know, some, I'm trying to think of a big movie, Lincoln or Call Me By Your Name or something like that--

Mark: Kane Hodder in Call Me By Your Name is like, is like, "Oh wow!" That is a tangent that you could not have paid me to come up with

Derek: I'm just saying, you could have Kane go in- I could see him doing a lot more work outside of the horror industry--

Michael: Kane and the peach?

Mark: Oh my God!

Derek: Because he is such a great actor, so I think a lot of it stems from that and the fact that the fans took as much ownership in the performance (of Jason) too, and made him wanna keep coming back. He's also the only person asked to come back

Mark: Have you guys ever shaved anybody?

Brennan: Huh. Yes.

Mark: Tune in next week to find out

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