Episode 34: “I Love Trash” (w/ Sam Wineman!)

''In this episode we reintroduce the newest member of our Queerwolf family, Sam Wineman! He picked perhaps the best film with which to do so: 1999’s THE RAGE: CARRIE 2! Michael struggles to parse out where the school day begins and ends, Brennan rants about Book Club, and Nay goes on the world’s worst hike. Plus, in Tea Time we sip on THE ACT, THE GUARDIAN, SCREAM, and YOU.''

Trivia
Former guest Sam Wineman's first episode as a host. Sam: "Today we are coming to you from the charred ruins of the Bates High School. And in the spirit of 1999, we are all wearing chokers. I klepto'd it." Sam's first appearance was on episode 14 with Katya.

Topics brought up during the episode: Poison Ivy, Rafael Moreau,

Tea Time
Michael: Scream (1996)

Nay: The Act

Shady Summaries
Nay: Don't worry about how mean people are to you now, you will have the chance to kill them later

Brennan: It gets better

Nay: (chuckling) Yes!

Michael: It's so weird that this movie had two directors

Brennan: The One Where Rachel and Monica Go To a Party But People Do Not Remain Friends

Michael: (laughing) I hate you!

Sam: Girl who hates snow globes learns that less is a lot more with a wet look. Murders her entire senior class and finds love

Brennan: Aww!

Sam: In that order

Michael: That's amazing

Pride Float
Brennan: So does this movie get a Pride Float though?

Sam: Hell. Fucking. Yes.

Brennan: Okay

Sam: It's a Pride float and it's covered in eight year old girls just--

Michael: Just Leeza's dead body

Sam: Did you guys notice-- that's horrific.

Nay: Just a car driving through

Sam: The car driving through

Michael: (laughing) It's just a giant windshield with a face stuck to it.

Nay: (to Michael) You ain't shit (laughs)

Michael: I mean, what is it, Sam?

Sam: I mean, nothing's gonna beat that, but the single queerest moment of this movie is for me when they're going through the drive-through to pick up the film--

Michael: Ohh yeah

Sam: And in the background there's a dance school open at like, fucking midnight

Michael: Yes!

Nay: Mmm-hmm, mmm-hmm

Sam: And there's a room of eight year old girls poorly, like they're dancing in the dark, with complete choreo--

Nay: Everybody goes to school at night!

Michael: Yeah!

Sam: Yeah!

Michael: Well they go to school twelve days a week

Sam: And it lasts the entire time! This is a real scene

Michael: I saw that, I noticed that

Sam: That's my Pride float

Sam: (to Michael) Pride float?

Michael: Yeah, I'll go along with the Pride float, I guess. Maybe a party

Brennan and Nay: Mmmmm

Sam: Just going along with it in this movie, it's not a good thing

Michael: I would definitely do a Trevor Project fundraiser in Lisa's name. Does that count?

Sam: Fair

Nay: Yes

Brennan: I would give Katt Shea-ruben a Pride float, or she's now Katt Shea. Okay, Katt Shea a Pride float. She deserves it

Michael: Yes

Brennan: This movie is questionable enough that I'm not willing to commit to the movie itself

Michael: It would get a Pride float in Ninety-nine

Brennan: Would it?

Michael: Probably

Brennan: 'Cause obviously, I dunno. I mean obviously there's lesbian subtext of suppressed feelings and all that stuff, but also a lot of the, any time something explicitly queer is mentioned it's in a negative light

Michael: True. Good point

Brennan: And I'm just not super into that currently

Michael: It doesn't get a Pride float. No Pride float

Brennan: Nay, what do you think?

Nay: Uhhh, no. No. No Pride float

Brennan: Just full Betty Gabriel from Get Out? (as Betty Gabriel) "No. No."

Nay: I mean, maybe there's a booth and if you want to be called a "dyke" through a scream, someone will scream at you that you're a dyke

Michael: Okay. "Yell 'Dyke' for a Dollar"?

Nay: Yeah

Brennan: I thought you said "screen" like through a confessional booth

Nay: Yeah. That whole sentence just wasn't working out

Michael: So it's got a positive… ends on a positive--

Nay: Yeah. People line up for things that they want to be called, and the dollar gets donated to charity

Michael: Perfect. I love that. Okay

Quotes
Sam: I'm Sam Wineman, the newest member of the Blumhouse queer clubhouse

Brennan: Any queer family is a chosen family and we have chosen for Sam to join our ranks

Nay: Right

Michael: Yes! Sam will be co-hosting the show with us for awhile and we're very excited you're here

Sam: I could not be more excited to be here. You are a podcast I actually listen to

Brennan: (amused) Honestly? High praise!

Michael: (laughing) You're such a liar

Nay: Yeah

Sam: Honestly, pretty religiously

Michael: Liar

Sam: I love you guys

Michael: We love you, Sam

Sam: I was living for last week and all of the paranormal talk. So, I'm ready for the spin-off too, where we just talk about the weird shit that we did

Michael: Oh my God we totally should

Brennan: Honestly? It might just happen on this one. Who knows? We are apparently not good at staying on topic

Nay: We'll see

Michael: Sam is a filmmaker and a writer and an all-around good person

Brennan: Raconteur

Sam: One of those three things is definitely true. I do make films. Speaking of which, I'm very excited about what we're going to be talking about today, because I love trash

Michael: That's why you're here

Sam: I like to pick it up out of the trash and dust it off and put it back up on the shelf where it belongs

Brennan: You like to dive into it like Scrooge McDuck?

Nay: (sings) "Ducktales, oooh-oooh!"

Michael: I love when Nay sings

Nay: Oh lord

Michael: When she was singing, (sings) "It's raining Brens!"

Brennan: This show is a musical

Michael: Yep

Sam: So, yeah. I love movies that age well and movies that don't age well. This movie does both.

Michael: I'll go first, since everyone always looks at me. I watched Scream this week

Brennan: Shocking

Michael: Yeah

Nay: Yeah

Michael: I actually haven't seen the first one in quite a while

Nay: In a couple months

Michael: Four or five days

Brennan: Did it remind you that it's the superior Scream movie?

Michael: Anyway…

Nay: Whoa

Sam: Hmmm!

Brennan: I mean, I love Scream 2, by the way, but...

Michael: I love them both. It's possible to love them both.

Brennan: Yeah, you can love both of your children

Michael: It's not, they're not mutually exclusive

Sam: It is Tea Time

Nay: Michael's bisexual for Scream and Scream 2

Michael: Exactly

Brennan: The two genders

Michael: Right. I watched it, and then I was talking to Chris Landon about it, and we were talking about how the movie itself is so amazing, but the great thing about it I realized this time while watching it, the opening scene with Drew Barrymore could literally be its own short film

Brennan: Oh yeah

Michael: And it's so fucking perfect. Like the whole movie's perfect, but that opening scene, it just gets me every fucking time. And I pick up little tidbits every time I watch it that I haven't noticed before, like some of the music

Brennan: The music is gorgeous. Marco Beltrami's music has never been better than in the Scream franchise

Michael: The score in Scream and Scream 2 are amazing, and those are usually the two scores I listen to when I write. But we got a brand-new TV, which has a really good sound system with it, and I heard undercurrents of the score in the movie that I've never noticed before, with the film playing at the same time, and it's just so brilliant, like everything about it is so brilliant. But yeah, I always go back to one of those movies when I am feeling like I just need just a really nice comfort food. So I watched Scream

Brennan: That's lovely

Michael: Mmm-hmm. Thank you

Nay: I watched The Act

Michael and Brennan: (delighted gasps)

Brennan: Ohhh!

Nay: I couldn't wait to tell you

Michael: Did you finish it?

Nay: Yeah. I finished it in like, a few days

Michael: Ohhh, it's so good

Nay: Yeah

Michael: It's so hard to watch. But it's amazing

Nay: It is… you know… wow

Michael: Right? Just to talk about

Nay: Yeah. Just remembering that anyone is capable of anything. And you know what I really loved? I loved how they show you some kind of context that lets you know why these folks are doing what they're doing, and it's just so real-life 'cause you really don't know 'til later. That's when you actually find out things. And I really love how they did that

Michael: Yeah, that scene with her father is heartbreaking

Nay: Yeah

Michael: It's like… oooof

Nay: Yeah

Michael: They cast that show perfectly

Nay: Perfectly. Also that goddamn Cinderella dress and wig

Michael: I mean that painting

Nay: (laughing) Oh my God!

Michael: I mean, that was a real painting, too, that they actually had

Nay: Wow

Michael: And it's like, it's unreal that it's real

Nay: Yeah

Michael: Yeah. So, did you enjoy it?

Nay: Oh, yeah. I couldn't stop it and I made a couple other people watch it, too

Michael: Yeah, yeah. Patricia Arquette is terrifying

Nay: Oh my God, amazing

Michael: So glad you watched

Nay: Uh-huh. I knew you would

Sam: I wanna jump in--

Michael: Have you seen it?

Sam: I haven't seen it. Or Scream, so I just….

Nay: Oh, man!

Michael: The thing I love about The Act is each season it's gonna be a new, weird "act"

Nay: Ohhh, really?

Michael: It'll be a crime each season, but they're only gonna do fucked up shit, they're not gonna just do like random crimes

Brennan: Okay, season two is gonna be about Idina Menzel's performance art from Rent (200X), right?

Michael: Something like that (chuckling) Yeah. Or The Ring Two? It'll.be about that crime? You should watch The Act, Sam

Sam: I definitely wanna see it

Michael: It's terrifying in such a non-horror way, right?

Nay: Yeah

Michael: Like I had tweeted a couple weeks ago that it's the scariest show on TV right now

Nay: It's a serious mindfuck

Sam: I saw that, because it's one of the tweets you didn't delete

Michael: I always delete tweets

Nay: I love a delete. On anything

Sam: Same

Nay: Fucking delete delete, no matter what

Michael: Yeah. Get it away. Get it out of my life.

Nay: Do what I want. I'm just gonna die anyway. Fucking delete it

Michael: Yeah! My Twitter, do what I want, Sam

Michael: Sam bringing it right away

Sam: Speaking of bringing it, The Guardian (199X)? Michael and I both had the good fortune of watching The Guardian. You were there, at the all-nighter?

Michael: (chuckling) Yeah, I was

Sam: Well, it wasn't an all-nighter, it was a--

Michael: I totally forgot about it. Did you stay the whole time?

Sam: I did, until the very last film, which was H20, and just 'cause I'd just seen H20

Michael: Again, so rewatchable

Sam: But I want to highly recommend this film to you, because--

Michael: It's so--

Brennan: It's a William Friedkin movie, right?

Sam: It is!

Brennan: Okay

Sam: Yes

Michael: How did I forget this? It was only two weeks ago

Sam: Your face staring blankly hurts because this movie is--

Michael: No, that's just my normal face

Sam: Your handsome face

Michael: Awww!

Nay: (softly) Gays

Sam: This movie is a straight white couple--

Nay: (sarcastically) Oh, fascinating!

Brennan: Horrifying

Sam: Right, already. Who can afford childcare, so it's obviously way out there. And so they're making a decision about--

Michael: But they do talk at one point about how tight money is? Oh, so funny

Sam: Right

Brennan: They're like, "Money! It's tight, right?"

Nay: Right

Brennan: "Tight."

Sam: And they think they're hiring Mary Poppins but they got a tree witch. This movie is bonkers

Michael: A tree witch. It's insane

Sam: The most wild editing. The lead female, Jenny Seagrove, I looked her up. This movie is her runway, every scene is a look

Brennan: Okay

Sam: She constantly acts in front of a fan, and it doesn't matter where she is, she's got full wind

Michael: So great

Sam: This movie has gruesome deaths, wonky editing and it's like, perfect for Mother's Day, so

Brennan: Okay!

Michael: Yeah, and the guy, the main guy, I forget his name, but he was Kevin Costner's dad in Field of Dreams for like the reveal at the end of Field of Dreams

Sam: My dad in my wet dreams

Michael: Yeah, super-dreamy but he's so fucking horrible in the movie

Sam: Never wearing a shirt

Michael: Never wearing a shirt, always in pajama pants, with no underwear. I kept looking

Nay: Wow

Brennan: I need to see this movie

Nay: (disappointed) Michael…

Michael: It's so entertaining. It's the dumbest thing. But it's so amazing to think that Friedkin directed The Exorcist (1973) and that

Brennan: Friedkin's done a lot of things. He's had a wide career

Michael: Yeah, and like ten years later he does Bug (2006), which is an amazing movie, so check it out. Nay, you'll fucking love it

Nay: Okay

Brennan: That sounds truly iconic

Michael: Brennan, you'll love it too

Brennan: Okay. Is it anything like my other favorite movie about ridiculously rich white people The Hand That Rocks the Cradle?

Michael: Oh my God!

Sam: Okay, so side note--

Michael: Kinda sorta similar

Sam: I'm running it on Friday at my house, with The Hand That Rocks the Cradle

Brennan: Oh, are you? Oh, perfect!

Michael: (chuckling) You're running The Guardian too?

Nay: Now that's a movie night

Sam: I do similar--

Brennan: No, it sounds so similar: She's so rich, she can afford to build her own greenhouse and hire a nanny. And the dad's also hot in that one

Sam: Yes

Michael: He is kind of a piece, yeah

Brennan: Oh yeah, Matt McCoy--

Nay: "A piece". Okay

Brennan: With that beard and those chunky sweaters

Sam: It's the same film but with more tree witch

Brennan: Okay, I'm gonna love it. You're right

Sam: The theme I'm doing is, "White Lady Wants a Baby". That's one of my favorite horror tropes

Brennan: Oh yeah

Sam: Or thriller tropes I should say

Brennan: And Julianne Moore is in it, so my recommendation…

Michael: I love The Hand That Rocks the Cradle

Nay: Hell yeah. Me too

Michael: All those early nineties thrillers

Brennan: Oh yeah. We should do that at some point

Michael: That. And Sleeping with the Enemy

Brennan: Oh, Sleeping with the Enemy is so good!

Michael: It's so good!

Brennan: That movie is one hundred fifty percent a slasher movie with no deaths

Nay: Oh yeah

Michael: It really is

Brennan: It's so good

Brennan: I've been reading. I'm pulling in Nay. I've been reading the book You, which the series on Netflix is based off of

Michael: Oh, cool!

Brennan: It is from 2014. It is written by Caroline Kepnis. I had recently watched season one of the show, so I was like I don't know if I'm gonna enjoy the experience of the book, because y'know, it's roughly the same plot. But I am loving the book

Nay: Cute

Brennan: Just 'cause in terms of an adaptation Lifetime you know, Lifetime'd it up. There's a lot of extraneous characters that are not in the book, it's much more pared down, but also the prose is spectacular

Michael: Ooh, I love it

Brennan: Like the form is what's giving me a reason to read it other than the plot, which I know. I know how it goes. I actually have a segment of the first chapter I wanna share with you

Michael: From the audiobook? Or you're gonna read it?

Brennan: I'm gonna read it out loud. I mean, please pay me for the audiobook. I'll do it, I'll do it. So in case you don't know, You is the story of Joe Goldberg, he works at a bookstore, he becomes obsessed with this woman who is, frankly, not that interesting. He kind of projects a lot of his feelings about how a relationship should be on to her, and here is the end of the very first chapter after she has bought some books from him and he has kind of imagined it as kind of this grand romantic thing instead of just an actual transaction. "You didn't walk in here for books, Beck. You didn't have to say my name. You didn't have to smile or listen or take me in, but you did. Your signature's on the receipt. This wasn't a cash transaction and it wasn't a coded debit. This was real. I press my thumb into the wet ink on your receipt and the ink of Guinevere Beck stains my skin."

Sam: Wow!

Michael: Whoa!

Sam: I wanna use my Audible credit on you!

Brennan: Thank you. It's disgusting. It's a beautifully horrifying piece and I'm really really loving it

Nay: Wow

Michael: I love the show 'cause it was such trash

Brennan: Oh yeah! The show is super--

Michael: I wanted every character to die in the show

Brennan: The book is, even more than the show, very much about how our lives are filtered through pop culture

Michael: Oh, cool!

Brennan: Basically every chapter kind of takes as its hook, a snippet of song lyrics or a scene from a movie or a scene from a book and it's just talking about all this poisonous lessons that he has internalized, because he thinks he is the hero of his own romantic comedy and he's horribly wrong

Michael: Right

Brennan: And it's really trenchant and observant and it's really really fun. I would really recommend it

Michael: Yeah, that's what I liked about the show, is that his character did reference film and TV a lot in his voice over, which I thought was kind of smart. (To Sam) You seen it?

Sam: Oh yeah. I couldn't stop

Michael: It's such trash. I love it

Sam: I started it and obsessed

Michael: Yeah

Sam: And have definitely dated a guy like that. Or have been a guy like that

Michael: (laughing) Sam, don't look at me!

Sam: (to Michael) Hiiiii!

Sam: Shall we get into the-- I was gonna say "meat and potatoes" but I'm a vegetarian

Michael: Potatoes and potatoes

Brennan: Potatoes?

Sam: Yeah, all the carbs

Nay: The Beyond Meat and potatoes

Sam: Should we kick it off with Shady Summaries?

Michael: Or do you want the trailer first?

Brennan: I'll play the trailer first really quick and then we can launch right into Shady Summaries. Sam, you must not be like a super big fan of us, that's kind of how we run the show

Sam: I'm sorry. My bad

Nay: Catty!

(Brennan tries to play the trailer but must sit through an ad first)

Brennan: This is a commercial. This is not promoted by Queerwolf. (chipper) Hey Sam, how's it going?

Sam: I'm four feet tall right now

Brennan: Ooooh!

Michael: (laughs) Don't be! You're amazing

Brennan: I didn't mean to cut you down

Nay: I mean, sitting down that's pretty tall

Brennan: That is true. One thing you need to be aware of on this show is that you will be constantly interrupted, and I'm sorry about that and it's not always gonna be me who does it

(After the trailer)

Brennan: Oooh, that's so good

Michael: It's a good trailer!

Sam: Yeah

Nay: It's good

Sam: And a super queer trailer

Michael: (chuckling) It's true!

Nay: It's true

Sam: "The others don't understand you"?

Michael: Yeah, it really is!

Sam: And I mean, they lay it out: Here's the theme

Michael: It's pretty great

Brennan: (to Sam) I really regret making fun of you. It was obviously a joke that failed so hard. It was my most beautiful self-own that's ever happened, so

Sam: Guys, what you didn't hear is the part where I cried, I had to leave the room. We edited it out

Brennan: You telekinetically knocked out all of the LaCroix off the table

Michael: My coconut LaCroix is on the floor!

Nay: Oh, lord

Brennan: (as Rachel) "It fell!"

Nay: Still tastes the same

Michael: It does

Brennan: Ew

Michael: I love carpet

Nay: Me too

Sam: This film had a pretty dark backdrop, and that's why I wanna get it out there now--

Michael: Do it!

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Sam: It's loosely based on the Spur Posse, which was a huge story in the Nineties and it would be presented very differently now, but at the time it was a group of twenty to thirty dudes who would rate women and their conquests based on a point system, but their victims included-- it was, you know, there was abuse, there was rape, there were children involved

Michael: As young as ten, I think I read?

Brennan: Oh my God

Sam: Yeah. So, it's dark

Michael: And they're called the Spur Posse 'cause the guy that started it, his favorite basketball team was the San Antonio Spurs

Brennan: Classy

Nay: Wow

Michael: Isn't that crazy?

Nay: Yeah

Sam: It's super gross

Michael: The Spurs should sue him

Nay: (laughing) Yeah!

Sam: And for me, the really gross part is the way they just got to get gigs on talk shows and it just kind of became this presence in TV that… it's not cool. Additionally, this movie is pre-Columbine by a month

Nay: Wow

Sam: So when looking at the bullying and the violence, thinking about it in terms of like, this movie was in theaters at the time of that tragedy. So when it was released to home video, we're receiving it at a different time

Michael: Yeah, Columbine was like four weeks later, right?

Sam: Yeah. So, just keeping that on the timeline, that's where this exists, and I think it's easy to see why in a lot of ways it was not as prescient as maybe it could have or should have been, arguably, depending on if you liked it. I loved it

Brennan: I did like it. I mean, I've seen it before. Was it a first watch for anyone here?

Nay: No

Michael: Oh no, I saw it in the movie theater

Sam: Same!

Nay: Yeah

Michael: I was so stoked. This was back when-- this came out, the "Scream trend" had peaked, so this was on the downward slide, but still, any horror movie that played around that time in the theaters I went and saw. Especially teen horror. And it was advertised kind of Scream-ish in a way

Sam: Oh, for sure

Michael: You know? Even though it's not a slasher movie

Sam: No, but it does directly rip Scream with, "What's your favorite scary movie?" That whole scene

Michael: And the phone call, and yeah

Sam: The obligatory meta moment of a late-Nineties horror film

Sam: But thank you for letting me pick it

Michael: Yeah! It's a great first pick

Sam: I picked this because I was super obsessed with this when I was in high school. I used to draw Rachel on my notebooks

Brennan: Really?

Nay: Gay

Sam: But it was not Rachel, it was me

Michael: Did you have the tattoo?

Sam: Super obsessed. And the football player whose butt we get to see later--

Nay: Yes?

Sam: Spoiler alert

Michael: Brian walked in on that part. He's like, "Why did they just do that?" I'm like, "Just go in the other room."

Sam: We should definitely talk about why they did that

Michael: Yeah

Sam: And there's a good reason

Michael: Okay

Sam: But, he looks like my crush, like this all felt so real, except I wasn't out. And so I identified hard with Rachel. Who, like, we follow her journey as a person who is suppressing these feelings, she has a best friend she's very close with. And once she loses that friend, she has a harder time suppressing her identity, and then it becomes more and more visible

Brennan: Mmm-hmm. Were you out to yourself yet? Had you sefl-actualized as, "I am a gay person and I'm not telling people," or were you still kind of figuring things out?

Sam: I was not figuring things out. I made a decision that that wasn't who I wanted to be

Brennan: Okay

Sam: And I took kind of dangerous action to make sure I wasn't. And I think that's why-- or destructive, I should say, which maybe is also why this particular story feels so relatable for me and a lot of people

Brennan: Absolutely!

Sam: Were you?

Brennan: Was I?

Sam: Yeah

Brennan: Um, briefly. But generally my self-idenity came at a time where I felt safe coming out, so they were kind of happening around the same time. Like me realizing that I was fully a Kinsey six was at the same time I was telling people about it, give or take a month or so?

Michael: (amused) "Kinsey six"

Brennan: I do remember a time though, I think I told this story on the podcast before… I definitely have. But it was a thing where it was supposedly this "True or False" test where you hold a string with a ring--

Michael: Ah, yeah

Brennan: And the way it spins is supposed to be like, true or false and I was making it spin to tell me that I wasn't gay and I was like, "I'm great. It's fine."

Michael: And you said it just like that?

Sam: I did that, but with fucking girls

Brennan: (gasps) Mmmm

Michael: I did that too

Sam: Yeah

Michael: Yeah

Nay: Me too

(Everyone laughs)

Michael: Nay…

Nay: But with guys

Brennan: Oh, okay

Nay: Yeah

Sam: That too

Brennan: Less fun

Nay: For real, though. Truly

Michael: It depends on who you're asking

Nay: It's like in hindsight, you're like, well, I feel like every man I've had sex with, years later when I've told them that I'm gay, they're like, "Oh well, duh."

Michael: Any girl I had sex with, I was drunk. I don't think I had sex sober with a girl, so. Dark

Brennan: I held hands with a girl in a hot tub once

Michael: Ooooohhhh! Did it go around school the next day?

Brennan: Kind of

Michael: Of course it did

Brennan: It was in eighth grade

Nay: Oh my God, do you remember when holding hands would go around school?

Brennan: It was a big thing

Michael: Yeah

Nay: They told us, they were like, "Don't play with fire."

Brennan: We broke up a week later.

Nay: "Holding hands? Playing with fire."

Michael: (chuckles) I always forget about your big Christian background

Sam: Sit on that brake stick? Is that what she called it? Playing with fire. I was listening to you, the Carrie episode, getting ready, I've heard that before

Brennan: Oh, yes!

Sam: I love that episode

Nay: Me too

Sam: And of course Mark was talking about his connection with Carrie and seeing it when he wasn't ready to see that part of himself, so I like that you asked that, because I think that's how this was for me

Brennan: That's really interesting. Great question, me

Sam: Yeah

Sam: This movie, I was telling Brennan on the way in, I went down a fucking rabbit hole today

Michael: On Carrie 2?

Sam: And I want to share it with you

Michael: Yeah, because I did some research and I couldn't find shit (chuckles)

Sam: Listen

Brennan: (dramatically) I have sources!

Michael: What search engine did you use?

Sam: I called Katt Shea… no.

Brennan: She is very present on Twitter

Sam: I asked Jeeves

Brennan: Slide into those DMs

Michael: She is!

Sam: She seems like somebody who would give a good interview. And I say that because of what I've read--

Nay: Oh yeah

Sam: But also listening to her commentary on the 2015 Blu-ray

Michael: Oh, Carrie 2?

Sam: Yeah. And it is redacted as fuck. So it's like she'll start saying something--

Michael: It's like seven different tones of voice in one sentence?

Sam: Well no, they just pull out the audio completely in places--

Brennan: Oh fuck

Sam: And just when it gets juicy

Michael: That's insane

Sam: And that's what sent me down this journey. I was watching it with Laverne and she was like, "Are you sure that's not just our Blu-ray player?" So if it was, sorry, but I found it (indistinct). Anyway, it started out with commentary from David DeCoteau

Brennan: Oh yeah?

Michael: Yes. Okay

Sam: Which, I'm already like, "That's queer as fuck. Great." And she talked about how when she first read the screenplay, she wasn't stoked about it. She got it on, you've probably heard about this, but she got it on a Thursday because she was called in to replace that director

Michael: Yeah, he--

Sam: The director of The Substitute… Robert Mandell

Michael: Yes. He directed School Ties

Sam: Yes!

Brennan: Oh!

Sam: And so she was called in to replace him, she read the screenplay once, took a meeting, read it again and was already in production by Monday morning.

Michael: He had shot like half the movie, too

Sam: So, yeah. She gets to set and she's like, not gonna match the materials so she decided I'm just gonna reshoot everything that he shot

Michael: And she had to shoot that all in two weeks, right?

Sam: Yes. Because they said they wouldn't give her any more budget or any more time

Nay: Holy shit

Sam: So she just did everything again. And she's like total-- she did Roger Corman films, so it's like School of Corman, just fucking nailed it

Brennan: Oh yeah

Sam: But she was in there, this is where she talked about it gets interesting on the Blu-ray, where it gets quiet. She said that she wasn't allowed to revise the script, but then she describes herself as staying up all night revising the script and then sleeping between shots. And there are conflicting parts of the interview where I've read online that she'll say yeah, she didn't do any revising but she was allowed to, quote, "make little changes to the scenes". So I, being the little queer that I am need to know what those changes are and if they're what I think they are, because I'm reading too much into everything and they totally are

Michael: Well, I wonder what-- but she reshot everything, but had the same material to work with?

Sam: Mmm-hmm

Michael: I wonder what the big difference was

Nay: Yeah

Sam: So, if you are interested--

Michael: Yeah

Brennan: Yeah

Sam: The shooting script is out there, online

Michael: Oh it is

Sam: And I read it. And I also took some pretty detailed notes

Michael: Is it different than what we see?

Sam: It is exactly the-- it's like exactly the same except for tiny changes that make this movie queer

Michael: Okay

Sam: Like it's tiny, tiny things

Michael and Brennan: Okay

Nay: You know what, Katt?

Michael: Thank you, Katt

Sam: Yeah, I see it, I'm here for it

Nay: Yeah

Sam: Like that whole locker room tampon thing? Her addition. The forty-five butts we get to see? That's her addition. You know, she took, she added her male gaze perspective, her perspective on the male gaze to it. What's interesting is, the scenes that hit, that if you look at the deleted scenes, I feel like they're scenes she was obviously going to delete anyways. 'Cause it's like a double. Like instead of the locker room scene it's like this dude eating meat, getting pressured to do it--

Michael: Eating meat?

Sam: It's the team's-- yeah, he's just got this big steak, but legit

Michael: Okay

Sam: And they're pressuring him into doing it. But she just like, she took the bullshit and replaced it with actual queer and feminist subtext. Or explicit material, depending on what you're looking at

Michael: Right. Yeah

Sam: I have some examples

Nay: Yes

Sam: If you wanna hear them

Michael: Uh-huh

Sam: Okay… and this is what makes it to me, a queer film, this clip is why it's explicitly a queer film

Nay: (to Sam) I love your hands

Sam: Oh, thank you

Nay: They're just all over the room right now

Sam: When I get excited about stuff I move around a lot

Nay: Just fly away

Sam: I might

Nay: I love it

(The "She speaks [on the] bus" clip is played)

RACHEL: She speaks! Her mouth opens and sounds come out! She didn't call all weekend, I figured her voice was gone.

Sam: I'm a needy bitch. I've been this person, like you're all pissed at your best friend because they didn't call you back--

Michael: Mmm-hmm, mmm-hmm

Sam: But it's actually because you're gay and in love with them

Nay: Mmm-hmm!

Sam: Or just in love with them

Nay and Michael: Yeah

Nay: Too true. Nailed it. Mmm-hmm

Sam: The original script is, "She speaks, she opens her mouth and words come out, the sounds are words." That's it

Nay: Ohh

Sam: So Katt added, "She didn't call all weekend. I figured her voice was gone."

Brennan: Oooh, yeah

Michael: There's already so much difference, yeah

Sam: It's a completely different moment

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Sam: Then when they do the the (kiss) thing where they kiss their tattoos?

Michael: So steamy

Sam: Those tattoos, they're. that's not part of the ritual in the shooting script, it's just the kiss. So, even though there was like a subtle tattoo reference, like she does have the tattoo in the thing, (Katt) puts it in a scene in a way that lets us know they're talking about this other dude that (Lisa's) fucking and that (Rachel) missed her, and she's super bummed about that. "By the way, we're still BFFs, right? We still have matching tattoos even though we're what, sixteen."

Brennan: Yeah, in a lot of the stuff you've mentioned, in terms of like the asses, in terms of the tattoos, that's not stuff that would've been needed to be written into the script, that's like when you're interpreting Shakespeare, like when you're like, "We're gonna do Othello in the 22nd century with robots or whatever."

Sam: Yes!!!

Brennan: Stuff that's completely outside of the text--

Sam: Absolutely!

Brennan: That she can just sneak in there visually, which is really interesting

Michael: Mmm-hmm

Sam: Yes!

Michael: I mean, that scene in the locker room where they're fighting, I don't remember there being that many butts. And there's a lot of butts in that scene

Brennan: (whispering) So many butts

Michael: So many big butts

Sam: Like a lot of butts, and nobody's in a hurry to put their towel on

Michael: Nobody! Dudes are sitting there talking with the towel placed gently over their genitals

Nay: Hangin' brain

Michael: And just hangin' out talkin'. The whole time they were fighting in that scene? There's a dude butt out, like ten feet away, acting like he has no idea what's going on away from him. He's just talking to his buddy naked

Nay: He was just naked. Some of the most homophobic men do the gayest shit

Michael: Uh-huh!

Nay: You think that's not gay?

Michael: Locker rooms, aggro locker rooms are some of the gayest shit

Nay: Absolutely

Michael: Kids in my high school, they used to slip and slide in the shower, the football team would slide around in the shower together

Brennan: That is exactly what I was gonna say of a story of someone whose name I will not reveal, but who told me a similar story of just sliding and slamming into people just completely naked in the shower

Michael: Yeah. Yeah. And the wrestling team used to do some really nasty shit that involved insertion

Sam: I want this podcast

Brennan: Okay…

Michael: Not body parts, but--

Sam: Okay, but legit though--

Michael: Into. Each. Other.

Sam: Men in a homosocial environment, presumably straight men… engaging in homoerotic behavior can do so and get away with it by being misogynistic

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Sam: So I think a really good layout of that is that tampon scene. He's like, he takes the character, it's like the football player, is it Kyle or, they all have like Kyle-Chad--

Michael: Mark

Brennan: Mark Bing, because that's the other friend's name we get here

Sam: Oh God

Michael: Yeah

Sam: Yes. So he makes Mark--

Michael: Played by Dylan Bruno

Sam: Yes! What a fucking stud

Brennan: That is a name

Sam: Let me, actually I'll just tell you.

Michael: (Dylan Bruno's) voice?

Sam: The coach goes, "You two ladies there gossiping?" And he goes, "No sir." And (the coach) goes, " Excellent. Then you can give me fifty at the field."

Brennan: Boring!

Sam: Do you have the clip?

Brennan: I do have the clip

Sam: This is what's in the movie

Michael: This is gay as shit

(The clip from the movie is played.)

COACH: Mister Bing, on your feet

Brennan: This (indistinct)

COACH: Turn around and drop trou

MARK: What?

Michael: "Turn around and drop trou"? (chuckles)

COACH: You heard me. Drop trou, shorts and all. Now, son!!! If you wanna stay starter on this team. C'mon son, you undress like a girl. Let's go!

Brennan: Weird

Michael: And why are you in a jockstrap with a (indistinct)?

COACH: After that half-ass block I just wanted to see if you maybe had a tampon string hanging between your legs.

OTHER PLAYERS: (Laughter and jeers)

Sam: Ah, see we're all straight because we hate women together! And you're not a woman!

Michael: "And wearing a tampon means you're less than? Uhhhh…"

Nay: (as a straight cis white guy) "Huh-huh, periods."

Sam: That wasn't in the shooting script. Way to go, Katt. I love that

Michael: I mean, it's pretty--

Sam: Great butt

Michael: That was actually the moment where Brian actually came in the room and saw it happen. He made fun of it but was then like, "That probably happens."

Sam: Oh yeah

Nay: What specifically happens?

Michael: Like a coach almost sexually harassing one of his players in front of all the other kids

Nay: Oh yeah. Yeah

Michael: 'Cause that's a way to emasculate somebody, and I'm sure that happens in locker rooms all the time

Nay: Oh yeah. I'm sure, too

Michael: Anyway

Brennan: (defeated) Yaaaay!

Sam: And I don't wanna say that I don't know this. I wasn't there. This is just me, trying to be an internet sleuth, and who knows? Maybe I have no idea what happened, or who put what where, but it seems like--

Michael: I mean her fingerprints are on it for sure

Sam: Yeah

Brennan: I'm just saying, that's what Katt Shea does with any material that she has

Sam: Yes

Michael: She elevates it

Brennan: Or perchance, have you seen the movie Stripped to Kill? From the Eighties?

Michael: No

Sam: No

Brennan: That movie is--

Nay: It's on Amazon, right?

Michael: And don't yell at me on Twitter--

Brennan: No, why-- okay, if you're mad about that? Chill. I'll make him watch it. But Stripped to Kill is a slasher movie set at a strip club and you think you know exactly what you're getting from that concept. But it was written and directed by Katt Shea, she was Katt Shea-Ruben at the time. But she, she lost a bet and had to go to a strip club at one point and she was dreading it. But when she went, she realized that stripping is an artform and she made that movie to highlight the artform

Michael: That's awesome

Brennan: So there's like full six-minute scenes of beautfiul--

Michael: Like dancing and performances?

Brennan: Yeah, stripper routines that are completely avant garde and strange and beautiful and interesting. And the slasher movie part is fine. But it's kind of a celebration of the art--

Michael: I wanna see this

Sam: This sounds incredible

Michael: This does sound incredible

Brennan: And that's just kind of what she does with what she has

Michael: Queer enough to do here?

Brennan: Actually, yeah

Michael: Okay, let's definitely do it. I'll watch it for the show

Brennan: You know, it's the Eighties, there's some iffy stuff about it

Michael: That's fine

Brennan: But we could definitely talk about it

Nay: I heard her tell that story at that triple feature--

Michael: Oh, that's right. You saw Poison Ivy and--

Nay: Yeah

Sam: (sighs wistfully)

Nay: And it's funny 'cause she first started talking about how she had lost the bet and was like, "Ugh, I have to go to a strip club." Like wow, straight women are so annoying. Then she kept talking and I'm like, "Maybe you're not."

Michael: She like used, like learned from it, it sounds like it was a big

Brennan: Yeah, she was open

Nay: Yeah

Michael: (Gurgle burps) That was a weird noise that came out of my mouth

Nay: It's that damn coconut LaCroix

Brennan: LaCroix, yeah

Michael: But it sounds like she took a tiny moment in her life and made something from it

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Michael: That's pretty cool

Nay: I want everyone to have this knowledge of dancers, you know?

Michael: Yeah. It's work

Brennan: Also, she had a new movie in theaters this year. She directed that new Nancy Drew movie with the girl from Stranger Things

Michael: Oh that's right! Yeah

Nay: Yeah

Sam: Ooooh!

Michael: Nancy Drew making a comeback

Brennan: It's already on Redbox, so that's probably not great for her, but check it out and give her the money from Redbox

Michael: Can we discuss just a little bit of the plot and how it all kicks off with Lisa's essentially jumping off the roof?

Brennan: Yeah

Sam: I want a whole episode for Lisa. 'Cause she deserves it

Michael: (sighs) So good

Sam: She dies twelve minutes into the movie. Points for acting

Michael: I know. Mena Suvari

Nay: Damn

Sam: Mena Suvari. Gorgeous. Great performance

Michael: Over Zachary Ty Bryan? Uch.

Sam: Well, come on. He was some of our crushes

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Michael: You know, I was thinking about that yesterday and I was like, "What were people in the Nineties thinking?"

Brennan: You were like, "He does nothing for me."

Sam: We were thinking--

Nay: I was thinking about him

Sam: He has beautiful eyes--

Nay: Yeah

Sam: And he's not JTT

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Sam: And you needed the alternative brother--

Nay: Yeah

Sam: And the other one was too young

Nay: Yes!

Michael: He looked like he smelled

Sam: You had to pick one!

Nay: Yes, you did have to pick one. Everyone, I don't know how old you are, but everyone my age was JTT

Sam: Mmm-hmm

Nay: Like wanted JTT, but I was like, "I want Brad." In the same way everyone liked Zack Morris and I was like, "I like Slater--"

Michael: Slater?

Sam: Yep

Nay: And Jessie Spano

Sam: Yes

Nay: Both of them

Michael: They were the more interesting couple

Nay: Yeah. For sure

Sam: How would you summarize a little bit of the plot, then? Or would you…?

Michael: I just wanna know like, the, I always instantly roll my eyes as soon as a female character either kills herself or does something violent over a douche. And in the movie, for me, I really enjoy this movie, I think there is some good statements in it, but it also-- it's hard for me to get into something deeply when it starts off that way, you know?

Sam: This movie is as flawed as it is perfect

Michael: I mean, yeah

Sam: And so, this is a great example of where it goes so fucking wrong

Michael: I mean, it starts at an eleven (laughs) with that. You know?

Sam: Yeah. Also, just to throw it out there, thirty-three seconds of the trailer are (Lisa's) suicide.

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Sam: That trailer's only two minutes long

Michael: Well, they show the suicide like, six times in the movie, too

Sam: Yeah, you get a flashback later--

Michael: They flashback to it

Sam: You get a dream. They give you the suicide from every angle

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Michael: (To Sam) Do you know any of the other backstory? Because I know they were initially going to shoot this in 1996 under the title, "The Curse", and I can't figure out: Does that mean it was not a Carrie sequel at the time? Did it not have anything to do with Carrie at the beginning?

Sam: From what I read, it was--

Michael: It was always Carrie?

Sam: Yeah. It was "The Curse: Carrie 2" and then what they shot when they were--

Brennan: (chuckles) That title is still so backwards. Sorry

Sam: My favorite title was the production one: "Carrie 2: Say You're Sorry"

Michael: Oh, that is a great title

Nay: Oh, yes!

Sam: I am living for that

Nay: Yes!

Sam: I wanna see "Hello Mary Lou II: Say You're Sorry"

Nay: ''Yes! Yes!'' "Mommy Stees: Say You're Sorry" I die for it

Sam: Yes.

Sam: But Lisa's like a tragic character

Michael: She is

Nay: Yeah

Sam: But also tragically written. She has no backstory, nothing going on. Also, she needs a Trapper Keeper, because when she went off that roof, it was papers everywhere

Michael: Yeah, why didn't she take 'em with her?

Nay: So mean (laughs)

Sam: And then Rachel comes up and touches her blood…

Nay: Yeah. All right...

Michael: And all those kids are like, hanging out by the car just standing there--

Nay: Yeah

Michael: And I'm like, "Would people do that?"

Nay: Yes.

Brennan: Yeah

Nay: They would pull out their phones, and--

Michael: Now, yeah, you're right

Sam: They'd pull out their phones, they'd touch her blood

Michael: They'd get their camera--

Nay: Someone would touch her blood

Michael: Like that kid with the camera?

Nay: I think people really will reach out and touch someone else's blood

Brennan: Yeah

Nay: It happened to me one time

Michael: What?!?

Sam: Whoa

Nay: I was-- first mistake, I went for a hike, okay? That was where I fucked up to begin with, all right? Go for this hike, me and my friend, we get lost, run across some random white man up in these mountains in Griffith (Park) and he's like, "I can show y'all a way," and I turned to my friend and was like, "I don't know about this. The sun's going down…"

Michael: I just love hearing your stories!

Nay: The sun's going down, and I had just watched, not The Hills Have Eyes but something where you just wouldn't want some random man in the mountains to lead you to safety. You're like, "Yeah, right. You're taking me to your lair. I already know."

Michael: Uh-huh

Nay: So anyway, he does eventually get us back to the parking area

Michael: Oh, that's nice

Nay: But, in order to get back on the trail there was literally, not just a cliff, a cliff is too, that sounds too serious than I mean. It was probably a six-foot drop-off, but not a cliff. But as someone who's not quite six feet tall, it's tall enough

Michael: Mmm-hmm

Nay: And the only literal way to get down was to jump. There were no other--

Sam: No

Nay: So of course I kind of like half-slide half-jump down like a dumbass and I scraped--

Michael: You scraped your knees up or something?

Nay: I scraped my elbows up--

Brennan: Oh God

Nay: And like my back. And he turns to me and he reaches out and he's like, (creepy voice) "You're bleeding," (normal voice) and he touches my bloody-ass elbow!

Sam and Brennan: (groans of disgust)

Nay: And you know, I lost it on my friend. I was like, "See? I fucking told you!! He's crazy!!!"

Brennan: Yeah!

Michael: "No more hiking!"

Nay: Yeah. "EVER!!!!"

Brennan: I was getting so tense during that story 'cause I was like, "I know he's gonna be the toucher, I know he's gonna be the toucher…"

Nay: Yeah, no, exactly!

Michael: Yeah!

Nay: The toucher

Sam: And then he licked it up

Nay: (creepy voice) "You're bleeding…"

Brennan: Oh God! That's so E.T.

Nay: Yeah, that's true

Michael: (creepy voice) "Your bloody elbow"

Brennan: "Whose car is this?"

Sam: My favorite part of that moment (after Lisa kills herself) is when the principal gets on the, no, it was Sue Snell, she gets on the thing--

Michael: Yeah, because the guidance counselor always makes the announcements (laughs)

Sam: "There's been a death. At one PM today we're gonna have a moment of silence." Whoa, they moved on fast! Like that body's still out there. Rachel's running through the woods

Michael: The other thing-- okay, we, I think you and I texted on this briefly yesterday

Sam: Bates High

Michael: What is this school's hours, and what days of the week do they go?

Nay: (laughing) Yeah. And curriculum. Like, when…?

Michael: Well, they go like, Monday, Tuesday Wednesday Thursday Friday Saturday Sunday Monday Tuesday Wednesday Thursday and then they have Friday off? (laughs)

Sam: And they don't get any time off for death

Nay: Right

Sam: Wild

Michael: 'Cause that's-- so, I need to know, because it's so stupid

Brennan: Well--

Michael: They're on the bus, they get to school, (Lisa's) in a dark hallway for some reason--

Brennan: It's the stroke of midnight when she's getting her books out of the locker

Michael: It's so dark! And then she kills herself, and they're like, "At one o'clock…" This day has been fifteen hours long--

Brennan: People are like, gardening on the roof?

Michael: Right!

Sam: During class!

Michael: I guess it was a-- (sighs)

Sam: No, because there's two people, it's not a gardening class. Those are hobbyists

Nay: Right

Michael: (sighs) It's so confusing. And there's like no protective layer around the garden club? And then there's kids everywhere when she kills herself. So is no one in class?

Brennan: It's everyone's free period

Michael: Yeah!

Brennan: Study hall globally

Nay: You honestly got kind of lucky, it wasn't that tall of a building

Michael: (shocked laughter)

Nay: Like you died fast

Sam: Honestly

Nay: Like, you know, that's, you took a risk, girl

Michael: That shot hitting the car is awesome though

Nay: Yeah, it is

Michael: It's like a really good shot

Sam: The one from the inside?

Brennan: Yeah

Nay: (groans in disgust)

Michael: And her bouncing off of it? Oooof.

Sam: Yeah

Michael: Yeah

Sam: So, from what I heard in the commentary, that one from the inside shot was not hers, it was not Katt's, that's like leftover material

Michael: It was like an insert left over from the other guy?

Sam: But maybe that was not that black and white

Sam: Friends, I would love to share with you a song about Lisa's death, if I can have your ear for a moment

Michael: (singing) "Give me a song…"

Sam: There is a The Rage: Carrie 2 musical out there

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Sam: This'll be, I think... if it happens this fall it'll be the fourth annual if I'm not mistaken? But a trans writer, Preston Max Allen, who's brilliant, wrote "We Are the Tigers," it's on iTunes right now I think

Michael: Oh cool

Sam: But it's-- he does great work, and I love Carrie 2, so yeah, this is a taste of what that is

Brennan: This is a track titled, "Lisa's Reckoning"

(The track is played)

LISA: (singing) I guess it's time for me to go. I wasn't really in this show. My suicide's not justified. My development was low. This song's already longer than my screentime, I guess that means I'm supposed to die now. Goodbye now. Wait, no. Since you have a song here, so let's take time to look at me for once because I just want mine since I got dumped off-screen… (The track fades out)

Sam: It goes from there, but it becomes a real song, it gives her the moment that she deserves, and we love that

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Michael: Yeah! It's so funny that she mentions that she got dumped off-screen, 'cause you totally don't realize that. I forgot about that

Nay: Right

Michael: It is a lot, It's a big meal the first time, to connect all those dots. And (Lisa's) pretty

Brennan: Okay…

Michael: No, but my point is they're all talkin' about what a frumpy dump and stuff she is

Sam: Oh my God I know

Nay: Because that's how it goes!

Brennan: Yeah

Sam: Yeah

Nay: Yeah. Everyone thinks they're ugly and someone else thinks you're pretty, and someone out here thinks Beyonce's ugly, you know what I mean?

Michael: Like they've got a chance (chuckles)

Nay: Sure

Sam: Okay, speaking of ugly, and I know this is shallow, but those outfits on those cheerleaders on the front lawn? They were all dressed like moms!

Michael: Yeah, they were. They all looked like mom jeans. Like it looked like an SNL commercial

Nay: And not in a hot way

Sam: I was around in 1999, we did not, we were not, like hot people were not dressing like that, right?

Michael: And why didn't they just put them in uniforms? Movies have cheerleaders wearing their uniforms all day long

Nay: Yes. 1999, it wasn't mom jeans, you had like a boot leg cut--

Michael: Yeah, they did have boot leg

Nay: You been tuckin' those boot leg cuts into the calf-length boot

Sam: Straight up

Nay: Yeah

Michael: The thin-ass cardigans? (chuckles)

Sam: There was a woman behind the lead cheerleader who was like six feet tall, convinced she was a teacher and then she started doing those moves and I was like, "Oh."

Michael: Same. I saw her too, I was like, "Whose aunt is that?"

Nay: Okay, me in high school. Like, how old is that bitch?

Brennan: This is all while that ska song is playing, right? In the beginning?

Sam: Mmm-hmm

Michael: Nay, my favorite thing you've ever said is, "With Black girls you can't tell if they're nine or fifty-five." (laughs)

Nay: Yes. Try me. (laughs)

Sam: So, speaking of teachers, what did you all think of Sue Snell?

Michael: Tragic

Brennan: She certainly was trying. Her best? Maybe not. I really liked the moment when Rachel first displayed her telekinetic powers

Michael: Same. It's cool

Brennan: That moment of recognition and of like, you can see that character's entire past in her eyes

Sam: Yes

Brennan: It's a really good moment

Nay: Mmm-hmm. It's true

Michael: It's also a great moment when the snow globe breaks and she throws herself back against the wall

Nay: Yeah

Sam: Hates snow globes

Michael: Terrified. But Sue

Nay: So what did each of you try to move with your powers when this movie came out?

Sam: My CD player, I used to try and pick the songs on shuffle

Brennan: Oooh

Sam: Like I'd hit shuffle and then I would hit play. Yeah

Brennan: Oooh! That's so good

Michael: I used to try to move my beverages closer to me when I was lying in bed

Nay: I dig that. Practical. Practical magic

Michael: Mmm-hmm. I was in college then, so it was probably a beer

Nay: Yes. Mom powers. "Bring me my purse!"

Michael: "Give me that beer!" My Chapstick!

Brennan: Did you try to move anything, Nay?

Nay: Yes. Especially after Matilda came out

Brennan: Oh, hell yeah

Sam: Mmm-hmm

Nay: I was trying to pour some Rice Krispies from across the room

Michael: (chuckles) Matilda

Nay: Just disappointed

Brennan: For me, I was not gonna be allowed in to see Carrie 2 when it came out. But--

Michael: How old were you?

Nay: Right

Brennan: I was-- when did this come out? Ninety-eight? Ninety-nine?

Michael: Ninety-nine. (You were) like four?

Brennan: I was five

Nay: (baby talk voice) Oh my God, little baby!

Brennan: I didn't even have a driver's license

Sam: Oh my God

Brennan: (defeated, softly) Yaaaaay… But yeah. My big thing, probably around that time was the Animorphs. And I remember spending like all of storytime in elementary school trying desperately to turn into an ant

Michael: Oh!

Nay: Awww!

Michael: Awww!

Brennan: I don't know why

Michael: To hide

Nay: Did Antz come out then too? Antz and Bug's Life?

Brennan: Oh my God--

Michael: Antz came out in Ninety-nine, I think

Sam: Ninety-eight

Brennan: You had to have touched the ant in order to have acquired its essence

Nay: Right

Brennan: And I'd touched ants before

Nay: True

Brennan: I was like, "If it's anything, it's gonna be this! I've never touched a tiger." Anyway

Michael: But Sue was so tragic, because I get why they wanted her to come back, they wanted a direct connection to the first film. But they give her such a sad, like, in-between movie one and movie two. She has no family

Sam: Nothing

Michael: She's back at her high school 'cause why the fuck would you go and work at the high school that caused all the trauma in your life twenty-three years ago, and is the worst, and granted, it's a new school, but your entire history is wrapped up in this event that happened when you were sixteen or seventeen years old. So no family. It sounded like, am I correct or incorrect in that it sounds like she did some time in a mental hospital

Brennan: Yeah, at Arkham

Sam: Yeah, she was at Arkham. By the way, this movie exists in the DC Universe, so--

Michael: I was gonna say, is she like the Penguin's mom or something?

Brennan: Should I be really glasses-pushing nerd right now?

Michael: Yes please

Brennan: It's a Lovecraft reference

Michael: Got it

Brennan: They're both, like Batman and Carrie 2 are referencing the same universe situation

Michael: Ohhhhhh! Wow! Okay.

Sam: I just wanna believe

Brennan: So actually…

Nay: I don't know what anyone's talking about

Michael: I know what you're talking about

Brennan: Arkham Asylum is a big thing in the Batman universe, that's where he sends all the villains

Sam: Yeah

Michael: Yeah. Which clearly is, didn't you know it's a reference to Lovecraft?

Sam: No, I love and respect that reference

Brennan: The only thing I know about Batman

Michael: I do, too. It's great. I love learning new things

Nay: Yeah

Sam: I'm rejecting it. Sue Snell was in there with the Joker. That's it

Brennan: Yeah

Michael: Yeah

Brennan: No, it's consistent

Michael: But (Sue's) story is kind of tragic, and then they kill her

Sam: And her death is so sudden and just a waste--

Michael: It's unnecessary

Sam: And a lot of her character is that way, she moves the plot along in all the right places. She does have one moment I like, and it's when that dude is like, "Are you sure you're just not trying to save a girl from twenty years ago?"

Michael: That's a great scene

Nay: Yeah

Sam: It's such a good moment of like, people speak up about abuse--

Nay: Mmm-hmm!

Sam: And you get gaslit

Nay: Mmm-hmm!

Sam: Because he's not wrong, she would feel that way after something like that twenty years ago

Michael: She's trying to give herself a second chance

Sam: Yeah. And that to me felt so real

Nay: Mmm-hmm!

Sam: Unlike everything else about her character

Michael: I mean it's ridiculous considering you know, the stuff that they have her do, but she is, she gives a pretty decent performance

Sam: She does

Michael: So there were actually moments where even when they go to the old burning high school, that you kind of appreciate the scenes with her and Rachel. And I kind of left the movie, not left, but turned the movie off, finished the movie this time and was kind of hoping, like thinking about how interesting a movie could have been if it was just the two of them. Or if this story was just centered around the two of them and maybe not with Rachel in high school, and what you could've gained from their relationship being the center of the film.

Sam: Mmm

Nay: Hmmm

Sam: Instead you get a teacher kidnapping a kid from high school

Michael: Yeah

Sam: "Let's just drive to another town!"

Michael: "You're gonna come with me."

Brennan: That's so very Scream the MTV series where, "We can just leave, right?"

Sam: That's how that works

Michael: And that, you could feel that while watching Carrie 2, was the Scream fingerprints were all over it by focusing on all these high school kids and trying to be funny and the interesting movie was kind of the B-plot with Sue and Rachel

Sam: Mmm-hmm. I love (Sue's) quiz though, when she's like trying to be subtle

Michael: Uh-huh

Sam: I relate to that. Just not having any sort of subtlety

Michael: Yeah

Sam: (to Brennan) And you have a clip of that and I think we should just play it

Michael: I like this clip

Nay: Yeah

Brennan: Yeah, it's like a "True or False" test

(Brennan plays the clip)

SUE: Answer "True" or "False. Again, "Sometimes my thoughts assume the form of a giant insect."

RACHEL: False

SUE: "If you want to play the piano well, you have to practice."

RACHEL: True

SUE: "Large furry animals crawl on my face every night while I sleep."

RACHEL: True. (beat) I have a dog.

Michael: (chuckling) So nice

SUE: Sometimes I can move things with my mind.

Michael: That's the music!

RACHEL: You can't make me do this

Michael: It's scary now

SUE: Sit down. I'm just trying to help.

RACHEL: You're not my mother!

Sam: (amused) Just zero to sixty

Nay: Right

Michael: Yeah

Nay: "Let's just throw this one in."

Sam: "Are you telekinetic"?

Michael: (laughs) She's not gonna be so caught off-guard she goes, "Yes. I-- whoop, didn't mean to say that!"

Sam: "True or False, Rachel?"

Nay: I was like, the first time I went to Planned Parenthood back in the day, this was like fifteen years ago, and their questionnaire was like, "Name, Address, Have you ever hooked up with anyone from the internet?" I went, "Wow." And that many years ago, I felt guilty about putting "Yes". I felt like so-- I guess it wasn't quite fifteen, I'm being wild with that. Not that long, ten, twelve, I dunno. But--

Michael: But isn't it funny to think,because there was, like people would shame people for meeting people on the internet

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Michael: And then it was people on dating sites, and then it was people on apps

Sam: If that quiz was today people would be like, "Have you met people from the internet?" And they'd be like, "Today?"

Nay: Yeah. "In the last twenty-four hours?"

Brennan: "One drove me here."

Michael: Well, when Brian and I started dating, we met on Scruf four years ago, people would kind of make fun of us for meeting on Scruf, but now people love it when we tell them that

Nay: Hell yeah

Michael: You know, how fast it can change, but at the same time it's like, "Fuck you!"

Nay: Yeah

Michael: I remember I had a friend once be like, "But you don't know him…" and not just Brian, but if I hooked up from an app or went on a date from an app, it's like, "You're just meeting these guys that you meet on an app." I'm like, "You're meeting people drunk at two-thirty in the morning at a bar. What's like-- what I'm doing is probably safer."

Nay: Yeah. Nobody knows anybody.

Sam: Nobody knows anybody

Nay: Exactly!

Michael: Not to shame anybody that picks up someone in a bar, but I was just--

Nay: Right

Brennan: It's not that different

Michael: Glass houses, girl

Sam: If I could order Postmates all the time, I would. Don't shame me for ordering in

Nay: For real

Michael: You know, Postmates and Grindr, combine the two because that's the shit right there. That would make people a lot of money

Nay: Sounds like a movie I've seen

Michael: Yeah, and just donuts on dicks? (laughs)

Brennan: What movie?

Nay: You know, where the delivery guy shows up and you fuck him

Brennan: Oh, a porn movie. That's the joke, I get it now

Sam: Speaking of technology, my burning question watching this movie was like, "How did teens ruin each other's lives before phones?"

Brennan: Look at Carrie 2

Michael: Depends on how much salt you were-- (chuckles)

Sam: Back then it was so much work!

Nay: Passing notes, okay?

Sam: Oh my God

Michael: Passing notes, prank calls, ding-dong ditch

Brennan: Throwing bricks through your window

Michael: Throwing bricks through a window. It would get violent

Sam: Also, when they call (Rachel) a "dyke" in that scene--

Nay: Yes

Sam: Totally not in the script that I read

Michael: Love that

Sam: They did call her, she does refer to herself as being a dyke in the drive-through

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Michael: I love that

Sam: That was something. But that, and Katt Shea added, or I presume she added what followed next 'cause it wasn't there, those moments where she's lovingly looking at those photos of her and her friend

Nay: (softly) Yeah

Michael: Mmm-hmm

Sam: Of her and Lisa? And then she lovingly strokes the photo? That's a long moment

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Sam: Not scripted

Nay: Mmmmm

Sam: So I think (Katt Shea) took those little kernels, and no, I'm not just trying to backtrack with this queer stuff but here it is, you plant it there. And then later, during this house assault which feels pretty gnarly and I think filming it in (Rachel's) point of view is claustrophobic--

Michael: It is!

Sam: When you hear that word in the fray, it becomes something else

Nay: It's true

Michael: It does, because it's violent and it's homophobic and it also, to me in his place it comes from a point of like, "Only women that wouldn't want this? Is a dyke."

Nay: Yeah

Sam: Mmmm

Michael: You know?

Nay: Zero to one hundred again

Michael: Uh-huh

Nay: Yeah

Michael: But I like that she took such a small kernel in a script and kind of made a little runner out of it

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Sam: Absolutely

Nay: You know, it's words like that-- well, I don't know how you feel about words like that, but if someone happens to call me a "dyke" to be mean, it's like of course you feel the hatred coming from them so that can make you feel a certain kind of way, but in the same moment, I'm like, "You see me though, don't you?"

Michael: (laughs) Woooow

Nay: It's like one time--

Michael: That's actually so true

Sam: Yeah

Nay: The front of my car is actually a little fucked up, and men love to be at a red light and be like, "Oh, I can fix that." So at a red light one time, this man looks over at the front of my car, he's like, "You know I got an auto body shop…" he's like, "Sir! Sir!" And I turn 'cause someone's yelling and I'm like, "Oh, you are talking to me. Okay, fine. Whatever. I don't care what you think I am." He's like, "I have a auto body shop, I can fix that for you." And I was just in the right mood to where my response was, "You should de-gender your customer service because I'm a woman."

Brennan: Oooooh!

Michael: Good for you!

Nay: And he was like, "Well stop being a dyke and looking like a fuckin' man!"

Brennan: Oh my God

Nay: And I couldn't stop laughing, because I was like-- typically when someone assumes my gender to be different than what it is, someone's like, "This person may be a man…"

Michael: Uh-huh

Nay: If I tell 'em I'm not, they don't believe me. But this guy, I was like, "I'm not a man," and he was like, "Well, ya fuckin' dyke!" Okay, well. You're not wrong

Michael: (laughing) Bright side!

Nay: (laughing) Yeah

Sam: Kill fee

Nay: (angrily) "I fix my own car!"

Michael: You pull a wrench out of your pocket?

Nay: (laughing) Yeah

Sam: This strangely ties to something in the script at the end that's changed. I think it's when they call (Rachel) a "lez". So, at the end of this film, for those of you who haven't seen it--

Michael: You can spoil a twenty year old movie, it's fine

Sam: Oh, definitely! And I will spoil it

Michael: Everyone dies

Sam: Oh man. Also, a movie called "Carrie 2"? Can you imagine if everyone didn't die? God, ugh. Waste of time

Sam: They spend like the first of this movie, the first hundred and twenty minutes making everyone so unlikable you cannot wait for them to die

Michael: Yeah, I know

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Sam: And then you know--

Michael: Including Cher Horowitz Two

Sam: God, I love the Clueless TV show!

Brennan: Wait, which one was she?

Michael: Glasses

Brennan: Monica. Okay

Sam: So she played Cher on the TV version of Clueless and I think in an iconic way

Michael: Yeah, she's good

Sam: She's incredible, and I love what she brings to this. The whole scene where she steals the lipstick--

Michael: It's really good!

Sam: Who puts the sample right on somebody's mouth?!?

Brennan: I was gonna say, is that true?

Sam: Oh, fuck off!

Michael: Is that a thing? Yeah, I was wondering that, too

Nay: Yeah, I know

Sam: And then she says, "Hold still," while she puts it on? I'm like, "Ucccch, you're just feeding into this."

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Sam: But at the end, the original line was, I think… do we have that clip?

Brennan: Of what?

Sam: That part where they're saying how many points Rachel has?

Michael: Or she's worth?

Brennan: Yes, but it's not great audio, so

Sam: Okay, no worries. Basically they just say, the difference is, they say something like, "Rachel…"

Michael: In the movie they say she's worth thirty

Brennan: Yeah

Sam: They say she's worth thirty, but it's because she said she was a dyke

Brennan: Yeah, so he gets points for the "conversions"

Sam: Yeah. And this is like just a tiny thing, but in the script it says, "Oh, you know, we thought she was a dyke, but…"

Nay: Ohhhh

Sam: Hey, that's different

Michael: It is!

Sam: That's changing from, "We assumed looking at you but now we know better because you fucked this friend," to, "She said she was a dyke, we're giving her thirty points." Which reminds me of that situation

Nay: Totally (chuckles)

Sam: But it's like they see her. They see her

Nay: Yeah

Michael: And they're jealous

Nay: Mmm-hmm!

Sam: Well, they should be with all that mousse she had going on, I mean

Michael: Girl had that tattoo that grew

Nay: Oh, I wanted that

Michael: You wanted that?

Nay: Yes

Michael: You want that heartbeat?

Nay: Yes

Sam: Absolutely

Nay: Yeah

Sam: We should all go get matching tattoos after this. Let's get the vines. I want it to go all the way through my face.

Michael: Every death is satisfying, too

Nay: Yes

Michael: Because they're all so violent

Brennan: Oh, it's so cathartic

Nay: Ooooh

Michael: It is. Except I wanted Mark's death to be worse than just drowning

Nay: Uh-huh. True

Brennan: That's true. But it's prolonged

Nay: It's good, though

Michael: It is. That's actually pretty-- they show a long bit of that, of him dying

Brennan: Yeah

Sam: And we get that whole face-off? Oh! Fucking slay

Michael: And Zachery Ty Bryan loses his--

Brennan: It's so-- it gets shot off with a harpoon!

Sam: She shoots him in the dick!

Michael: It's so great

Nay: (laughing) Yeah!!

Sam: Also an addition

Michael: So great

Sam: It was a shotgun to the groin before--

Brennan: Ooooh, that's so good

Sam: But (Katt Shea) was like, "Harpoon to the dick, go into the bottom of the pool."

Brennan: Yes!

Michael: Ohhhh!

Nay: Okay, Katt

Michael: And Monica gets her glasses smashed up in her face

Brennan: And doesn't (Rachel) then use that harpoon to escape the pool later?

Michael: Yeah

Brennan: That dick harpoon?

Nay: Oh yeah. Mmm-hmm

Michael: Yeah, she does

Nay: (softly) Damn

Sam: "I (dick) harpoon"

Brennan: Oh my God

Sam: That's a mood

Brennan: It is! And I don't want things to get too real, but if these people had survived, they'd be on the Supreme Court right now.

Nay: It's true

Sam: Oh my God

Brennan: This is a really challenging movie to watch with these characters

Michael: Especially Zachery Ty Bryan

Nay: Yeah

Brennan: Watching them get brutally murdered was very nice

Nay: Wonderful

Michael: Well, that's the thing about time, like, twenty years ago I remember seeing this movie and just the way the kids acted, being like, "This is so unrealistic." And as you grow older and start realizing that people just present their shittiness more now than they used to twenty years ago, whether it's the internet or the power of Trump. You watch that scene where (Zachery Ty Bryan's) essentially like, "My Dad's a lawyer, so I'm gonna get out of this," and you're like, "Oh yeah, that actually happens."

Brennan: And they're talking about tarnishing these boys' reputations for horrible crimes that they committed

Michael: Yeah. "Why would you do that to some of the most valuable--?"

Nay: Yeah. That's what happens. (chortles)

Michael: I mean, it does

Brennan: Yeah

Michael: "You can't do this to some of the most esteemed people in town," or something like that is what they say, and that's Katt Shea in that scene, right?

Sam: Wait… is she? (gasps) Queen!

Michael: I think that's--

Sam: Oh my God!

Michael: 'Cause it said in the credits, Katt Shea as "Assistant D.A."

Sam: I love that

Michael: I thought it was supposed to be a policewoman, but I think that was her, because then it said, "D.A. Something" and some guy in a suit came in and I always thought that was the mayor, so I think that was Katt Shea in that scene

Sam: Can we share a quote that just reminded me of what you just said? It's from Preston Max Allen, because I had asked him about this when he wrote it, it being his play, I was like, "Well, what as a queer person drew you to (Carrie 2)?" And his response was like, "Eh. Carrie already had a musical and this one wasn't taken." I was like, "All right, well, in retrospect did anything change," and his response was, "Underscore did a reunion concert of the show last year around the time Brett Kavanaugh was a major news story. I was shocked at how without changing a word from the show from the year before, and without changing themes from a film from 1999, the conversation almost felt so on the nose. It was as if it was trying to make a glaring point about what was happening with that case. It seemed genuinely as if my decision to work on the show was reactionary to making a point about rape culture and the power white cis men have to make their own rules and be in this big horrifying club together. Which is what Carrie 2 is about." So well said

Michael: So well said

Brennan: Yeah

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Michael: So well said. And the only thing about Carrie 2 that makes it fantasy is the ending.

Brennan: You mean how Jesse gets the dog Walter?

Michael: That, and that most of these people don't get their comeuppance

Brennan: Yeah, sorry

Michael: You know?

Brennan: Not time for joking, I'm sorry

Michael: Yeah, but no, how 'bout that ending though?

Sam: How 'bout that remiiiiix!! "They're all gonna laugh at you!" Untz-untz

Michael: (laughing) That's so good! The CD death?

Sam: Please.

(Brennan starts playing the song in the background)

Sam: Yes

Brennan: Oooh! That's got a nice stereo to it

Sam: Mmm-hmm

(Everyone listens to the song for a moment)

Michael: I'm like ready to take my clothes off!

Nay: It's like "Ay, ay, ay… "

Michael: "Oooh, oooh, oooh…"

Nay: (indistinct)

(The song ends)

Sam: I need three more minutes of that

Michael: Seriously!

Sam: It ends way too soon

Michael: I love the CD death so much

Nay: Yes!

Michael: I wanted to see them enter her body

Nay: Yeah

Michael: 'Cause I don't think you see it, right?

Brennan: You see 'em in the arm, right?

Nay: Yeah

Michael: Kinda. I wanted one to go right in her fuckin' forehead

Nay: Yess!

Brennan: Turn into one of the Cenobites

Michael: Yesss! Crossover. Girl looks over. "The Rage: Carrie 2 - Hellraiser"

Sam: Confession, though, and this makes me a bad horror gay, I don't know how I feel about the ending. I know I'm supposed to be living for this revenge. And I want to, I do feel conflicted

Michael: About what?

Sam: About this person who fuckin' kills everybody.

Michael: I wanted her to kill everybody

Sam: Yes they deserve it--

Brennan: Yeah yeah yeah

Sam: And it feels good and it's fun and I wanna see it, and I leave thinking like, "Fuck." You know? I dunno. It doesn't feel good

Michael: I wanted her to kill everybody and live. That's the thing I'm disappointed about

Nay: Yeah, that's why it didn't feel good for me

Michael: Exactly.

Nay: Why did she have to die?

Michael: Why did she have to die? Especially that way, a fuckin' roof fallin' on her?

Nay: Yeah

Michael: Also, telekinesis it off of you!

Nay: Yeah

Michael: Or whatever. TK it away

Nay: Right

Sam: She could telekinesis Jesse into the pool, why not TK it away?

Michael: TK the roof off of you, girl!

Sam: You moved everything-- maybe it was heavier than CDs though

Michael: She wanted to die

Nay: Yeah, she wanted to die

Michael: She wanted to die

Brennan: That's true

Michael: What's that?

Sam: It was heavier than CDs

Michael: True

Nay: Right

Sam: We haven't talked about Jesse at all, and it's because he doesn't matter. Jesse is (Rachel's) white bread boyfriend

Michael: He's like the Alicia Witt of The Rage: Carrie 2

Nay: Jesus

Sam: His whole storyline is he opens with, he's hooking up with a girl in the car and she's trying real hard to impress him and he just doesn't give a fuck. Then he almost runs over (Rachel's) dog, then another car does it first. Which by the way, telekinesis that shit out of the way so your dog doesn't die

Michael: Right. Well, back up to the sex with Tracy?

Sam: Yes

Michael: Awful. But he gets out of the car, he's like done bangin' her and he's like so low energy he's just like, (groans half-heartedly), you know? And then he gets out of there ashamed of himself, but as soon as he gets out of the car, he starts doing like, Stifler moves

Sam: Yeah

Nay: (groans in disgust)

Michael: It's just like, "What character are you? What character are you."

Sam: He is the tool. Because I feel like I knew guys like that

Nay: Oh, definitely

Michael: He is the tool. He's also like the thirty year old senior (chuckles)

Brennan: I mean, he's supposedly being positioned as the quote-unquote "true romantic" 'cause he read into Romeo and Juliet--

Michael: Right. Shakespeare

Brennan: And all of this stuff

Michael: My eyes almost fell out of my head during that scene

Sam: I feel like that Katt knew that guy was a piece of shit

Brennan: Yeah

Sam: And so when she directed that, that's why we get at the very end, like the bonus ending where he's in front of the mirror and Carrie shows up, or sorry, Rachel shows up and shatters the glass--

Michael: Shatters the glass?

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Sam: We get like his sad, dark circles under his eyes

Michael: Because he's going to be haunted forever?

Nay: Yeah

Sam: Because he's a piece of shit

Nay: Yes

Sam: He is a product of the patriarchy

Brennan: When he asks her out, he does the thing of, "I'm not gonna let you leave until you say 'Yes' to me."

Michael: Right! Also, he doesn't give her a time to meet him

Brennan: Equally important

Michael: I hate when movies do that! I hate when movies don't give each other time or when people don't say "goodbye" before hanging up a fucking phone

Brennan: Uh-huh

Michael: Anyway. Brennan, sorry

Brennan: No, no. It's horrifying! This is why I hated the movie Book Club

(Nay and Michael laugh)

Brennan: Follow me, here.

Michael: "So I'm having a Mary Steenburgen."

Brennan: No! The other one, literally the other one

Michael: Candace Bergen

Brennan: No, Woody Allen's, from like--

Michael: Mia Farrow?

Brennan: No! From Manhattan? Or Annie Hall?

Michael: Diane Keaton

Brennan: Diane Keaton, yes! So, she has a meet cute with Andy Garcia, he's the pilot of a plane she's on. And he's like, "Oh, do you wanna go grab coffee when we're on the ground?" And she's at first like resisting, like, "No, no, no." But he basically threatens to crash the plane if she doesn't say yes to him

Michael: Huh!

Sam: Hmmm

Brennan: I'm supposed to think this is cute and romantic and I'm like, "Can we just push him out and have the co-pilot take over?" I hate scenes like that. Especially when they're supposed to be romantic or sweet or whatever. It's despicable

Nay: So glad we've learned

Sam: And I think that maybe that's what justifies (Rachel's) terrible makeover, is that we were all just waiting for her to get more goth!

Nay: Yeah

Sam: And then she shows up in that fucking hospital gown and no hair product and we're supposed to be swooning?

Michael: Oh my God, a hospital gown? With like, Kleenex

Nay: Right. I'm like, "Give that bitch an undercut."

Sam: Yes! (laughs)

Nay: I know she wants one. (Imitates the sound of an electric razor cutting hair)

Michael: It looked like she was wearing blue Kleenex

Sam: But I bring Jesse up because he has this forced moment where he's got his arm on her and it catches fire, and he looks at the fire like, "I can't go anywhere. I'm gonna stay right here with you."

Michael: So Brian watched the last ten minutes with me, he was like, "Why isn't he moving his arm?"

Sam: His arm's on fire!!!

Michael: (sappily) "It's because he loves her!" (normal voice) I love the moment in the car when he pulls her top of him and they're making out and she's like, "The parking brake's sticking in my back," and then she's like, "I've never done anything like this--" his acting there is atrocious, where he's like, (woodenly) "Oh. Oh. Oh." (normal voice) And then he's like, stuttering like, (woodenly) "O-o-o-okay." (normal voice) I'm like, "You're fucking awful, Jason London!"

Sam: Yeah

Michael: You didn't learn anything from Dazed & Confused, dude?

Nay: He's like, "Just to be dazed and confused."

Sam: The "I love you" moment though, when he's like, (as Jesse, woodenly and softly) "I love you."

Michael: (as Jesse, woodenly and sodtly) "I love you."

Sam: The fact that you can zoom in on this screen with telekinesis and replay it, pinch--

Michael: And turn it up

Sam: And now all of a sudden it's hi-def

Nay: Right

Sam: And you can hear, and we're supposed to believe their camcorder can hear through walls and windows? I'm like--

Nay: Right

Michael: Also, wasn't the filming being done through the window on the other side of the bed?

Sam: Oh yeah. There's not a chance they could hear that--

Michael: Got that amazing close-up, too

Sam: It's true love

Michael: Mmm-hmm

Sam: True love is magic

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Michael: I just love that she went for it on her first time. Ride that cowboy

Nay: You know, it be like that sometimes

Michael: Yeah

Brennan: Yeah, Lady Bird style

Nay: Yeah. Waited long enough

Sam: If we were to sum up the film, I feel like it's the line, "The male is the carrier."

Michael: Ooooh!

Brennan: Yes!

Sam: With zero explanation. And also, (Rachel) looks back and she's like, "Okay."

I mean, these two women are like, "Yeah. Believable."

Nay: Right

Michael: Believable

Nay: Yeah

Sam: We have no story behind it, just, that's it

Michael: Ralph White

Michael: Really quick too, Eddie Kay Thomas's character coded gay to me

Nay: Hmmm

Brennan: Yeah! He had that one scene where he acted like he was (Rachel's) gay best friend and then they never talked again

Michael: Yeah. Uh-huh

Brennan: That was very strange

Sam: Ooooh

Michael: Except for when he wanted to get into the party

Nay: You were very good at that

Michael: Yeah

Sam: Well, thank you for letting me share this homophobic gem with you

Michael: Yay, Sam! Welcome Sam!

Sam: Thank you! Yay! This has been fun!

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