Episode 25: “Clive Barker’s Scary Boner"

''This week the queer wolves go guestless to catch up and discuss the lengths one British woman will go for the good D. It’s time for 1987’s HELLRAISER! Michael gets confessional about underwear, Mark really pushes his limits in finding as many ways as possible to describe the Cenobites’ outfits, Nay discovers a bloody dealbreaker, and we answer our first letter from a listener on air! Plus, in Tea Time we sip on SPIDER-MAN: INTO THE SPIDERVERSE, THE WAILER, and Salt & Straw ice cream.''

Trivia
Michael: This week we are comin' at ya from hell

Mark: Oooh!

Michael: We are literally in hell

Mark: Awwww

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Michael: (sarcastically) Yaaaaay

Mark: They were all right. They were all correct. Here we are

Nay: It's cute in here

Mark: Yeah. It's very Bauhaus, I like it

Michael: Very cute

Topics brought up during the episode: "Bravo Row" on Santa Monica Boulevard and Robertson Boulevard in West Hollywood, Hellraiser trailer, music from Fifties drive-in trailers, the score for Hellraiser, The Hellbound Heart, the unused score for Hellraiser from Coil, Christoph Waltz, Inglourious Basterds, Brennan's appearance on Horror Queers, Brennan's appearance on Geek K.O. on the Leprechaun movie

Tea Time
Nay: Instagram page called "Dildo Nightmares", Copycat

Mark: Spider-Man: Into the Spider-verse

Michael: Laughing at straight people

Brennan: The Wailer (aka La Llorona) (2006)

Shady Summaries
Michael: I know we kind of don't like do Shady Summaries too much, but does anyone want to weigh in there at all?

Mark: I mean, I had one, but it's not shady

Michael: Yeah, I have a one-sentence summary as well. Go for it.

Mark: Mine is, "What I did for dick."

Michael: Oh my God, mine is very similar, "The dick so good you'd kill for it."

Mark: Yeah, you know. And I was going to, I don't know if there are any Chorus Line fans here, but I was like...

Michael: Are you gonna sing again?

Mark: Well, I was trying to figure out...

Michael: (sings) "'Bout diiiiick!"

Mark: Well, I was trying to-- well, it was like, what would the lyrics be, you know? But all I could come up with is, (sings) "Kiss your soul goodbye, and point me toward that good dick…" and it's just Julia singing about what she did for dick

Nay: Literally all I wrote was, "Wow, the things one does for good dick."

Pride Float
Michael: So does it get a Pride float? Hellraiser?

Nay: Yeah

Michael: Both? '87 and 2019?

Mark: It gets a whole leather weekend

Nay: Yeah, leather Pride

Mark: It gets a whole…

Michael: It gets a leather Pride in Palm Springs

Mark: Mmm-hmm

Nay: Yeah

Michael: And one in Germany

Mark: Oh, it is the IML of horror films, and…

Michael: Oh, I wanna go to Germany, wear leather

Mark: (German accent) Berlin

Michael: A dungeon, or like a big factory?

Mark: Listen, people in Berlin know how to live. Let's put it that way, all right?

Michael: Just cigar smoke everywhere?

Mark: Mmm-hmm. Whew! It's too hot in here

Nay: It is actually really hot in here

Michael: Pride float, Nay, can you describe the Pride float?

Nay: I mean, it kinda looks like-- I guess the float-- you know, I don't know. I hadn't thought about it, I had thought about...

Michael: Hidden vaginas everywhere

Nay: Hidden? Like, "Surprise!"

Michael: Yeah, like they're there, but you have to find them. You know, kind of like throughout the movie

Nay: Ohhh, so it's like an interactive float?

Mark: They're like Easter eggs

Michael: Vagina, vagina hunt?

Nay: People are invited to come look for the vaginas?

Michael: Yeah, like the hidden vaginas

Nay: Like an Easter egg hunt

Michael: Yeah. Float's made of leather…

Mark: (sighs)

Michael: And I'm on it...

Mark: What would the float be? I mean basically...

Michael: The attic?

Mark: I…

Michael: Hell? Just a hell on earth float? Chains?

Nay: I mean, chains and hooks…

Michael: Whips and chains?

Mark: Someone suspended

Nay: And someone suspended…

Michael: Yes!

Nay: With consent

Mark: Yes

Michael: Yeah

Nay: Suspended from the hooks…

Michael: Consensual suspension, yes

Nay: And then, you know, there's eight thousand parties

Michael: And everyone's throwing blood at them

Brennan: Oh! Sorry. I'm just imagining being suspended like P!nk during one of her concerts, like on the ribbons

Michael: Samesies, but chains in your skin

Nay: Yeah, the hooks…

Michael: Nipples and clamps...

Mark: Yeah, but we're talking about like a fetish night suspension, nipples clamped, full leather...

Brennan: Why not both?

Mark: I mean, I mean P!nk, doing a ribbon show in the middle…

Michael: If P!nk consents, she could be the one chained

Mark: I mean, listen, she's...

Michael: I love her

Nay: I mean the gays would show up for that

Michael: Oh fuck yeah

Mark: (as a basic white gay) "Oh my God, did you hear P!nk's into suspension now?"

Nay: The white gays

Michael: (as a basic white gay) "P!nk is in suspension and we have to throw blood on her?"

Mark: Can you imagine?

Michael: And she's singing, (sings) "I'm coming out so you better get this party started…"

Nay: (sings) "I'm comin', I'm comin'..."

Mark: All right. I think we've reached, we've hit a wall

Michael: I'm sorry, I'm tired

Brennan: iTunes used to make these "Essentials" playlists, and there was a "Queer Pride" one and that song was on it, and I don't know if this is a gay song, but I'll take it!

Michael: Well, this playlist is called "Hell Priest"

Brennan: Sure

Quotes
Michael: Our Queerwolf daddy (the show's mascot) is here, so that's all that matters

Nay: Always. Always

Michael: We still need to name them

Mark: I mean, I've heard like, "Wolfie". Someone be like, "You know, I like your mascot, Wolfie."

Michael: I like that

Mark: And I'm like, "Sure." W-o-l-f-y or i-e?

Michael: i-e

Mark: Yeah

Nay: Awwww

Michael: That's how I saw it in my brain

Brennnan: Like Wolfrick?

Nay: Wolfrick?

Mark: We should give him the most generic gay clone name possible, like Derek

Brennan: Blake

Michael: Wolftopher?

Mark: Wolftopher?

Michael: That's so dumb!

Mark: (as a generic gay clone) "Deryk with a 'Y'."

Michael: (as a generic gay clone)."It's Mahtt. M-a-h-t-t."

Mark: (as a generic gay clone) "He's a host at Pump. And no, we're fully committed tonight."

Mark: I just know Salt and Straw has a chocolate brownie flavor that's good enough to make you kill your grandma

Michael: Yesss! Yeah, so I hadn't been to that part of (West Hollywood) in the longest time, and I went to that Salt and Straw three times in five days

Mark: Okay

Michael: And I had that, and I fucking killed my grandmother

Mark: All right!

Michael: It's so good!

Mark: R.I.P Nana Kennedy

Michael: What was that ice cream place by your house?

Mark: Can you imagine if we were actually in hell…

Michael: Talking about ice cream?

Mark: Sitting around the Clive Barker vision of hell, which is just dusty and cobwebby...

Michael: Chains...

Mark: Corridors…

Michael: Leather...

Mark: The Leviathan is in the corner and we're just hanging out going, "Oh my God, you know what the best Salt and Straw flavor is?"

Nay: It's like (indistinct) evil

Michael: I'm in a harness

Brennan: If they're right, and all the gays are going to hell, it's basically like twenty-four/seven brunch, right? Just flames everywhere...

Nay: Flamers

Brennan: And ice cream gossip

Mark: Hi, Producer Brennan!

Brennan: Oh yeah, that's me. Hello. This is gonna be a weird time

Nay: Drag brunch.

Mark: Drag brunch?

Nay: Drag brunch-off

Mark: You're right, it would be an eternal drag brunch

Nay: Yeah

Michael: (chuckling) Oh, God!

Brennan: Satan is a drag character

Mark: Completely

Nay: Oh, definitely

Brennan: Those horns? Mmmm.

Michael: Go on...

Mark: 'Coz he's a messy bitch that lives for drama…

Brennan: Yeah

Mark: Getting kicked out of hell, I mean heaven

Michael: I just want to imagine like, in Clive Barker's hell, in leather, but discussing ice cream, eating it with those tiny little plastic spoons

Mark: Tiny plastic spoons

Michael: That don't melt

Mark: That's right, because in hell you can only get a sample. That's it. Like one a day

Nay: That's why it's hell

Mark: That's why it's hell

Michael: And then you're being asked, Nay, guys are asking you if they can have your Cheetos. That's your version of hell

Nay: (chuckling) That's my version of hell. (sighs) Oh my God. Really, anyone asking if they can have any of my food, period, is kind of my hell

Michael: That was like…

Mark: I don't think I'm a sharing person either

Brennan: Mmm-hmm

Nay: No! Who walks up to someone is like, "Can I have some of that?" "No! No you fucking can't!"

Mark: Listen. I find that a completely reasonable stance

Nay: Thank you!

Michael: Same! I don't mind going out to dinner with the intention of it being like a shared food thing

Nay: No, that's fine

Brennan: It has to be premeditation

Nay: Yes!

Mark: Exactly

Nay: I gotta be prepared to share

Mark: We're going to tapas, it's like, "All right…"

Nay: Yes. Exactly

Mark: "I am emotionally girding myself to not get enough of the thing that I like at tapas tonight. That's fine."

Michael: Next time either of you see Brian, ask him what I'm like when it comes to sharing food

Nay: Oh my God

Mark: Oh, boy

Brennan: Nay holds up a finger with eight stitches in it

Michael: (laughing) Like my teeth have bitten into it?

Mark: Like a feral animal?

Michael: It's… yeah. He likes to share

Mark: Okay

Michael: You offer him any food, he will say yes every single time.

Nay: Okay, so I won't

Michael: You know how people are like, "You want a bite of my sandwich?" And they're probably gonna say, "No," Brian'll be like, "Sure! Chomp." Hi honey, don't kill me

Brennan: If you don't want it to be eaten, then don't ask

Nay: I want to be less selfish in that way, but, I just, I haven't figured out how to do it

Michael: Yeah. I grew up in a family with six siblings, two parents, so nine of us at a dinner table…

Nay: Mmmm

Michael: Mmm-hmm. Prison eating

Mark: You know guys, I gotta say, hell isn't so bad. It's fine. I mean, it's slow, but…

Michael: You're all here

Mark: You know, it's like we're catching up. It's fine. When I got here, Brennan and I were like, "When was the last time we had a host-less, er, a guest-less show?" Host-less show, just dead air. Just a fuckin' hour of dead air

Michael: When was the last time we did?

Mark: I don't remember

Brennan: I'll look it up, hold on

Mark: Rebecca?

Michael and Nay: No…

Michael: It was one of the Listener Request Months, I think

Nay: Night Warning

Brennan: Night Warning, yeah

Mark: Ohhhhh!

Mark and Nay: (sung like the Hot Pockets jingle) Night Warning!

Michael: Oh! That was a good one for us to do

Mark: Yeah. Yeah

Michael: I guess

Mark: I feel like every time we don't have a guest, we're not on good behaviour, and this is like the episode, the wheels just come off, and we just careen off the road into the woods, and here we are

Michael: So great

Mark: And here we are!

Nay: I brought something really special. I fell into this particular hole on this Instagram page called, "Dildo Nightmares".

Michael: Oh my God!

Mark: Which hole?

Nay: Which is fucking amazing

Mark: Curiously, that was an alternate title for Hellraiser

Nay: Right. So this is a pro. You all need to go @ dildonightmares on Instagram and just look at the…

Michael: Oh! Myyyyyyy Lord!

Nay: Michael's looking right now

Mark: I like that we started with like, movies and TV shows, and now it's just like…

Michael: Oh my God!

Mark: This horrifying sex Instagram

Nay: Well, I was…

Michael: This body like bent over backwards…

Nay: I was gonna talk about watching Copycat for the first time in a long time

Mark: That is a fun movie

Michael: That's a dildo nightmare, too

Nay: Right. But when Michael was checking Mark's ass for something earlier...

Michael: Oh hell no!

Nay: Oh, I know. They're awful!

Brennan: What?

Mark: What the fuck am I looking at?

Michael: It's like a face on a butt…

Brennan: Is it a dildo?

Michael: But the nose is where, in the buttcrack

Mark: Oh!

Nay: So, they're not all dildo…

Brennan: Okay

Nay: Some of them are like, half a Real Doll, like maybe it's just a torso

Brennan: Oh, okay

Michael: I love that the caption that whoever posted this wrote just says, "I'm personally offended by this."

Nay: (laughing) Yeah! It's a great Instagram

Mark: It's like, it's not sex positive, it's not sex negative, it's like sex mrrrrr?

Nay: It's like, "We found this thing, you have to look at this."

Mark: Right. "Here, now this is your problem."

Brennan: I'm into that

Michael: Now this is cute. A big dildo sticking out of a pumpkin

Mark: (groans)

Michael: Super cute

Nay: On-brand for us

Brennan: In a couple months our Tea Times are just gonna be, "I saw a bird today."

Michael: I could go on about that. That was hot

Nay: So yeah, that's what I did

Mark: I think we lost Michael until the end of the episode

Nay: Yeah. Michael, give me my phone back

Mark: ...and I wanted to see (Into the Spider-verse) on a big screen, and it's-- I'm literally competing with Dildo Nightmares now

Michael: I'm listening!

Brennan: Sorry, yes!

Michael: Never thought you'd say that in your life, did you?

Mark: Listen, I…

Michael: And you were losing

Mark: "All my life, I have competed for attention with Dildo Nightmares."

Michael: "I always lose to the Dildo Nightmare."

Mark: Spider-Man: Into the Spider-verse is, you know, I was just prepared to be like, "Okay, it's a really great cartoon." Like people had been waxing ecstatic about it so long, and I was so behind, and it was, it's just kind of magical

Michael: Won the Oscar, right?

Mark: Yes. It's gorgeous, first of all, and it manages to cover so many bases that most superhero movies don't ever come near because clearly the live-action ones are terrified of being too, for lack of a better term, quote-unquote "out of the box" in terms of how they approach classic IP. And this movie is utterly bananas and heartfelt and, I mean it manages to cover everything from Brooklyn gentrification to being biracial, to having Spider-Pigs. John Mulaney as Spider-Pig?

Nay: Uh-huh

Michael: He's cute

Mark: Oh, he's fantastic. It is a movie that is insane and wonderful…

Michael: Oh, that's great

Mark: And so well-written and so well performed, and it's-- the animation is mind-boggling and inspired

Michael: I'm glad you said "performed", because people underestimate how hard voice acting is

Mark: The voice acting performances to a "T" are fabulous

Michael: It's hard work

Mark: Yeah. I am just, very end of the line in terms of like, the last person in America to see it…

Michael: I haven't seen it either. Have you seen it, Nay?

Nay: No

Michael: Brennan?

Brennan: I have! It's so rare to see a movie that's luscious and experimental in its animation, because it's really copying the dot matrix comic book printing…

Michael: It looks beautiful

Brennan: But also actually has a good story and characters you relate to. Miles Morales's Spider-Man is…

Mark: Wonderful!

Brennan: The Prince of the World

Mark: Yes! I enjoyed it more than I ever have any other live-action Spider-Man movie

Brennan: Oh for sure

Michael and Nay: Oh, cool!

Michael: Dinner and a movie, Nay

Mark: The animation-- yeah, you guys need to see it on a big screen before it disappears. Make the time, because by the end, the animation is downright psychedelic.

Brennan: Oh, yeah. It's trippy as hell

Nay: That sounds awesome

Mark: It is trippy, it is-- I dunno. I just can't rec it enough

Michael: Before we get into La Loner, I can't even say it, the corner for Brennan, I have been laughing at straight people this week, for two reasons

Nay: This week?

Michael: Especially this week. One, I was loving all the straight people being obsessed with Lady Gaga and Bradley Cooper's performance and all the goss they were giving each other about whether or not they were sleeping with each other…

Mark: Oh, God

Michael: I'm like, "Straight people are so adorable!" So that was tickling my funny bone this week, but the other thing that has been-- I've been riotous for two straight weeks about is the promotional campaign for ABC's Whiskey Cavalier

Mark: Stop!

Michael: (laughs) I like, can't get enough of it! It is so hilarious. Its tagline is, "Danger just got fun." I haven't watched it, never will. I just love it so much, because the ads are hilarious. Just everything about it is funny. My favorite was during the Oscars. They must have showed commercials for it every twelve seconds

Mark: Endless, endless commercials during the broadcast

Michael: My favorite was the quote that they kept doing, "The season's cool new show." For some reason that was just killing me, 'coz I was imagining it being like my seventy-five year old aunt being like, "They're totally right. It is the season's cool new show."

Mark: I found the ads, I almost started to find the ads to be sort of charming…

Michael: Yeah!

Mark: It seemed like the leads knew…

Michael: Yeah, they're having fun

Mark: Their look, and they're delivering their punchlines like, "Yeah. We're doing this show. We're sexy sexy sexy spies! And we're pretending to not like each other even though we're gonna bone!"

Michael: It's like Moonlighting by way of the CIA, y'know?

Mark: Yeah

Michael: I just kind of love that ABC's ads for it, too, are kind of a wink because they're totally…

Mark: They're leaning into the hokey

Michael: They're leaning into the hokey, and there's also no its ands or buts about it, they're literally trying to sell it like it's a Grey's Anatomy type show. The ads are using the same exact music from Grey's Anatomy that were promos for that show three years ago. They're setting up the characters the exact same way, like the sex, everything. I'm like…

Mark: Meredith Grey shows up and cries

Michael: Yeah. Patrick Dempsey, like the guy is probably called like, "McCIA-y". It's just, I dunno. It tickled my funny bone all week

Mark: Listen

Michael: And on the way here I kept seeing bus stops with their faces, and I like, was laughing because they're selling the sex and they look like brother and sister.

Mark: That would be quite a twist

Michael: That would be amazing

Nay: Right. Y'all meet on 23andme, okay?

Mark: That would be fascinating. Where you're like, "Uh-huh, they're spies, okay they're attracted to each oth-- they're what???"

Michael: "Whaaaaaaat???"

Mark: "Well, I guess I have to watch now!"

Michael: Scott Foley's a tasty dish, and Lauren Cohan, she's getting that bank finally. Good for her

Mark: Listen. She survived Walking Dead for a long ass time.

Michael: She was like, "Fuck you. You're not gonna give me my money? I'll get it elsewhere."

Brennan: And Scott Foley has looked twenty-five since he started working in 1860

Mark: Oh yeah

Brennan: He's been around forever!

Michael: He looks so great

Mark: No, there is a portrait of him full of worms in his attic. It's bizarre

Michael: That would actually tie him to today's movie

Nay: True

Mark: Scary things in an attic?

Michael: Scott Foley is the real-life Frank?

Mark: Hey. Listen.

Nay: All these hints about what we're talking about

Mark: No, I think the cat's out of the bag, we're pretty much like, "Splat!"

Nay: "Clive Barker's Hell"

Brennan: Honestly (The Wailer) wasn't very good. But…

Michael: Hooray

Nay: Shocking

Brennan: It was very much in my wheelhouse because it was a straight-up Cabin in the Woods slasher movie.

Michael: I love that!

Nay: Oh, cool!

Brennan: Yeah, about La Llorona

Nay: That actually sounds so good!

Brennan: Yeah, um, the kills are very weak, because they really couldn't afford to make much gore, so it's like you see a shadow of a woman and then it cuts to them covered in blood, and you're like, "I'm sure something happened. It must've been scary." But the thing is, there's one really good scene involving a bathtub where her face gets pressed up against a shower curtain, which is pretty cool

Nay: Ew, God!

Brennan: Yeah. She also slashes people with these really…

Mark: That's actually, we should pause there for a second because that's-- I don't wanna run by that.

Brennan: Okay

Mark: That's so disgusting

Nay: For real! Ugh!

Mark: To have-- it's bad enough that you have to touch it, to pull it and push it…

Nay: Right!

Mark: But to have your face, buh

Nay: My fucking face? No. Absolutely not

Mark: Wow

Nay and Mark: (noises of disgust)

Brennan: Yeah, that's gross. She slashes people up with these five long Freddy Kreuger-like fingers

Nay: Oh yes!

Brennan: Which is not part of the folklore

Mark: No, I don't recall that

Michael: Do they have anything on 'em or are they just her fingernails?

Brennan: No, they're just really sharp

Nay: This is modern La Llorona with the stiletto acrylics

Brennan: Oooh, I love that!

Nay: That's hot

Michael: She could stab me!

Nay: (chuckling) You're so stupid

Brennan: It's a cabin in the woods movie. There's three guys, there's three girls, but the guys are shirtless for the entire movie…

Mark: That's different

Brennan: And there's like a five minute scene of them frolicking around in this river full of waterfalls and it's very Call Me By Your Name

Mark: Like Room With a View

Brennan: Yeah!

Mark: And have sex with La Llorona

Michael: They lose their pants by then?

Brennan: (sighs) No. But there's this one guy, it's 2006, he's wearing this black sweatband around his arm about half an inch from his elbow the entire movie. It's over the course of a whole weekend. He has like three different wardrobe changes, including taking his shirt off to go swimming, the sweatband is there.

Nay: With like a Livestrong bracelet? Wait, what year was this?

Brennan: Oh yeah, no, that's totally--  I feel like if you took the sweatband off, his arm would just fall off

Nay: Maybe!

Michael: Or it's just a really bad cut

Brennan: I don't know. It was disturbing. Speaking of moldy, just mildew situations…

Nay: No, the shower curtain! Bluh!

Brennan: What else? (sings) There's one more thing! I lost it! (normal voice) Okay, it's just-- it wasn't great. But there were those interesting elements and you know, a movie with a lot of shirtless men I will watch, so I can live with it

Nay: Yeah. Yeah

Mark: You know, there's at least seventy-three more La Llorona movies

Brennan: Oh! I'm almost halfway through. I have like, nine left. It's very exciting

Mark: Oh!

Michael: Well, you'll have a tenth in April with the theatrical one coming out, right?

Mark: Making her long-awaited return

Brennan: Hey. There's been some great movies, and some not great movies, just like with any topic

Mark: Exactly

Brennan: I actually have a letter from a listener that I'd like to share really quick if that's okay?

Nay: Oooh, yes!

Michael: Yeah

Mark: (Muppet voice)."Mailbag!"

Brennan: I know! We should clip that out and use it as our intro every time

Michael: There's only one letter in it

Nay: Well, yeah, of course

Brennan: It's like a plastic sandwich bag

Michael: More like a mail tray?

Nay: Someone's underwear

Michael: Into it

Mark: Jesus, Nay

Michael: Panty pudding

Brennan: It's a bit of a long letter, so I'll try to get through it pretty fast, and I took out some of the parts that were just in praise of us, thank you…

Nay: (mock annoyance) Goddammit it, Brennan

Mark: I need positive reinforcement

Nay: Right? I feel like shit today, can you read that? No, I'm kidding

Michael: I need it this week

Brennan: It's a long letter

Mark: All right, all right

Brennan: So the guy who sent it in, his name is Jeremy Grace, and he is a fourth-year film student and disability advocate…

Michael: Hi, Jeremy!

Mark: Hello Jeremy

Nay: Mmm-hmm

Brennan: Yeah! Thank you so much. But yeah, he was born with cerebral palsy, which impacts his mobility, so he uses a walker to get around, but he's also a huge horror fan and a member of the LGBT community so this is what he says: "I've been thinking about disabled representation in horror recently and how there isn't much of it. Ones that come to mind are like Franklin in The Texas Chain Saw Massacre (1974), and Mark in Friday the 13th Part 2. They're shown as whiny and insufferable and therefore marked for death." Brennan cutting in, editor's note, to say I disagree that Mark is whiny. He is very hot and beautiful and I love him. Anyway, back to the letter. "As a disabled person, I never identified with these characters. Recently there has been better representation within the genre with films like Hush (2016) and A Quiet Place. Those films are displaying strong, independent characters who are capable of fighting against the monster. But not many positive portrayals other than that come to mind. Funnily enough, one character I did identify with was the Blind Man in Don't Breathe. I know he's the villain, but seeing a disabled character who is capable of owning and mastering the environment around him, and is also able to hold his own against an able-bodied opponent without being easily defeated was something I found really cool."

Nay: Oh yeah

Brennan: "There's not a lot of that in horror, so for me, despite him being the antagonist, I was able to identify with certain elements of the character. My hope is to one day see a horror film with a physically disabled character where they're not annoying or marked for death or the villains, but capable of battling the monster without help while also being able to generate empathy from the audience. It's a question I've been pondering for a while, so I thought I'd reach out and ask if you guys can think of any notable or positive depictions of physically disabled people within horror cinema. I do love to listen to you, so maybe you have some thoughts."

Nay: The first person that came to mind is the doctor on The Walking Dead after he has to cut his leg off

Michael: Hershel!

Nay: Hershel, yeah. And everyone kind of  helps, like he's not just an afterthought like, "Well, Hershel's automatically dead because he can't run with the rest of us."

Brennan: That's a good one. And the one that rose to mind immediately for me was Fiona Dourif's character in Curse (of Chucky) and Cult of Chucky. She's a paraplegic, she's in a wheelchair

Michael: Yes! I was trying to remember her name. Especially, to go back to Hershel, I was gonna add to what Nay was saying, the fact that he took this, what happened to him, and ended up finding something he was even better at in the process on the show

Nay: Yeah

Michael: Which was essentially caring for everybody. Didn't they put, didn't they almost have him start acting-- maybe I'm misremembering because I stopped watching the show, but his character after that started almost acting like the in-house doctor at that point, still?

Nay: Definitely. Yeah. I literally forgot that he's a vet until you just said he-- and I'm like, "Oh yeah, he isn't even a doctor!" But yeah, he's a veterinarian

Michael: Yeah. So that's pretty cool. It's a good question. I almost would like to have time to think about it and discuss it

Mark: I mean, the one that comes to mind is Mike Flanagan's Hush. She's pretty badass

Nay: Hell yeah

Michael: She's amazing. It's a great movie

Mark: Yeah. It's a really, really effective movie, and uh, you know, yeah. That's all I gotta say… I mean, certainly there's more

Nay: Y'all tweet us with your characters

Mark: Please do

Michael: Yeah

Nay: So we can retweet it

Michael: Yeah. Tweet at us your favorite characters and then we'll also have to pick one of those films

Nay: Yeah

Brennan: Yeah, for sure! Obviously I can only speak for myself, but as an able-bodied person this isn't a topic that I feel like I can approach with a level of, I dunno, worthiness, or… the words are not coming

Mark: Authority?

Brennan: Yeah, authority. I don't have an authority on this, but I would love to hear from people. I would also like to say like, literally Ash in Army of Darkness has one arm and he kills everyone in that movie

Mark: Oh! I mean, hello.

Michael: Yeah, it's a really good question to pose and it's a really good conversation starter. It's a topic we haven't brought up here at all, I don't think? So, was it Jeremy?

Brennan and Nay: Yeah

Michael: Thank you for your letter

Mark: Thank you, Jeremy

Nay: For sure

Brennan: If anyone else wants to send in letters, we'll take 'em.

Michael: But Fiona Dourif's character in those two Chucky movies are pretty great

Brennan: Nica is her name

Michael: Nica. And she's the final girl. In Curse.

Brennan: Yes she is. Spoiler alert: No comment on the other one. But yeah, she's great in both of those movies, and both of those movies are good. There are other ones, like Los Ojos de Julia, that Guillermo del Toro produced. It's about a woman that's slowly going blind and kind of discovering this weird world of shadow men who want to murder her.

Michael: What's that wonderful one movie from the Sixties with…?

Brennan: Wait Until Dark?

Michael: Is that it?

Brennan: Probably…

Mark: With Audrey Hepburn?

Michael: Yes! Amazing film

Nay: ''Oh. Yes!''

Mark: And then there's also that episode of Night Gallery with Joan Crawford that Steven Spielberg directed, and she plays a really rich lady who is vision-impaired and she wants to see, and is unfortunately too proud to follow doctor's orders and crazy things happen

Brennan: Oooh!

Mark: That's a good one

Michael: I'd really like to do research on like, a queer horror film, you know what I mean?

Brennan: Yeah! Intersectionality in terms of horror can be very difficult sometimes, but I'm sure there's something out there

Michael: Yeah

Mark: Get at us, please

Michael: Thank you, Jeremy

Nay: Oh, Julia

Michael: Julia. Bad bitch

Mark: Oh!

Michael: I kept making note of her purple eyeshadow

Nay: Oh Lord, she had some looks

Michael: Mmm-hmm

Nay: She had some looks. I mean...

Mark: Oh, her "Mantrap at the Bar" look?

Nay: Ha-HA! Yes!

Mark: If I had an ounce of bravery, I would replicate that for Halloween, but I just can't pull off orange

Nay: (sighs) That blouse

Michael: Her freshly-fucked hair look…

Nay: Okay, Michael

Michael: Where it looks like she just put mousse just on the sides...

Nay: Right

Michael: I'm like, "I get it."

Mark: No. No. She looks like the Memorex guy, like she just got-- it's fucking fantastic

Michael: I was like, "Maybe it's his cum." Anyway…

Nay: Right

Mark: Jesus!

Nay: I thought that as well

Michael: Good "D" cum?

Nay: Nothing would surprise me in this movie

Mark: You guys both watched the movie going, "You know what? That could be jizz."

Michael: Good "D" Cum hair products. It'll hold that wind from that-- anyway

Mark: Christopher Young opening the movie with a waltz is so, it's so inspired and it's such a counterpoint to how utterly gory and nasty the movie is that it's what creates the tension just right off the bat in Hellraiser that your entry into the movie is romantic...

Michael: Right

Mark: And grand, and kind of fantastical, and then it drags you into this completely opposite direction that is utterly fucking depraved. And it's fantastic

Michael It is! But at the same time, it's still a love story in a way…

Mark: Oh my God, it so is!

Michael: So the music goes along perfectly. And my thought again, and I know I've brought this up before, the Eighties were just, and maybe even the Nineties and late Seventies, horror films loved a long title sequence with an amazing piece of music to start off the movie

Mark: Mmm-hmm

Michael: Watching this movie, and I haven't seen it since college, as like a full-fledged adult, the music means more to me now than it did then. And granted, there's scores to me that were like, Scream (1996) is a good example, and Jaws and Halloween (1978) are scores that you hear the first time and they immediately register in your head and they stay there. But as a young adult, I don't remember the score much, but thirty seconds into this movie, you hear the music and it's literally a black screen with white title cards and you're like, "I'm fuckin' in."

Mark: Yeah

Michael: It sets the mood perfectly. And the music (Coil's unused theme for Hellraiser) Brennan just played, in a way-- we only heard what, twenty seconds?

Mark: Mmm-hmm

Brennan: Yeah

Michael: I was like, "Oh, this is just a play on Nightmare on Elm Street."

Mark: It's ambient, it's ponderous, and it has its place…

Michael: It sounds like a Nightmare on Elm Street film, which is also Christopher Young, right?

Brennan: He did Part Two

Michael: Okay

Mark: I'm not sure that Hellraiser would-- I think it would be lauded for the visuals and the phenomenal story, and you know, just the care that Clive Barker put into it, but I don't know that it would have reached the heights that it did without Christopher Young's score

Michael: Well, yeah, you're right, it's-- when you look at it visually, there's not a big scope. I mean the set pieces are amazing and it's gorgeous and it's beautiful, but it's essentially a few locations…

Mark: It's a house

Michael: The score makes it feel …

Mark: Epic

Michael: Like a monstrous film, like a huge film

Mark: The score really underscores the completely epic themes of the movie, and I dunno…

Michael: Yeah. It's very-- it's such a grand movie, but if you do take that music away, the scale is completely gone.

Michael: What do you think, Nay?

Nay: I think it's a fucking disgusting movie. I mean, I love it, yeah, of course.

Michael: Frank reborn is just like...

Nay: Jesus fucking Christ

Michael: The start of that is just so fucking awesome

Mark: Fabulous

Nay: Oh. My God

Mark: Fabulous

Michael: And we get a "D" shot…

Mark: (to Nay) And you'd seen it before

Nay: Yes. I watched it for the first time, I think, ooof, I might have just become a teenager. I dunno. It was early

Michael: (as Nay) "It was like two weeks ago!"

Nay: Right. And I was remembering as I was rewatching it now, how terrified I was that I was going to go to hell. I was like, "There is no way that I'm a good Christian girl if I'm trying my damndest to watch this movie," like, y'know

Mark: Right

Nay: I had to wait, like, "Okay, Mom's at work, dah-dah-dah-dah," you know, all these things and it freaked me the fuck out. Obviously I'd never seen anything like that, and I think it still freaks me the fuck out when I watch it

Michael: Oh! It's so, like…

Mark: Titillating

Michael: Dirty. Titillating though, too

Mark: Dirty. It's a really dirty movie.

Michael: "Do I have a scary boner?"

Mark: (British announcer voice) "Clive Barker's… Scary Boner"

Michael: "Scary Boner"

Mark: To me, I mean, certainly in the Eighties, it feels like it's one of the pop horror films that's post-religion in a way that it combines elements of Judeo-Christian iconography and Buddhism in equal measure, while also mixing in the decade's most obvious quote-unquote "threat to religion," the gays. And I dunno, it's interesting. I always thought that because it includes hell, I always thought of it as kind of like, a masturbatory fever-dream of the Christian right, you know, Clive Barker sort of satirizing that

Michael: Yes. One hundred percent

Mark: But watching it for the hundredth time…

Michael: This week

Mark: This week. Seriously, I love this movie so much. I was like, "Oh, this is much more of a Buddhist horror film in a lot of ways." He's including an idea of hell, but certainly not the Biblical version of hell that we've come to be-- for many of us have come to be taught. You know, in Buddhism, they teach all suffering, and I'm misquoting, all suffering is the result of the pursuit of pleasure, and Frank and Julia are definitely in a singular quest to seek pleasure, and all it does...

Michael: Right. Maximum amounts?

Mark: Yeah. Unleashes, and to unleash suffering everywhere. It's interesting to compare Hellbound Heart to the movie, in that when Frank talks to Julia in the movie like, "This, the box." Which in the movie they call the Lament Configuration, whereas in the novella it's called the Marchand Box. But you know, he goes, "I was seeking out pleasure or pain, I didn't care which." In Hellbound Heart he's definitely seeking out pleasure, like levels of pleasure that are untold. Has anybody read the novella?

Michael: (whispers) No, I'm sorry

Mark: Do you wanna know-- so, what I find fascinating is that the movie sort of glides past this, but in the novella, the Cenobites ask Frank for consent

Michael: Oh, interesting

Mark: When they appear, when he finally figures out, you know, he unlocks the box and they appear, they literally say to him, like, "Will you-- do you want to come with us?" And they're like, "Your most treasured depravity is child's play beside the experiences that we offer. Will you partake of them?"

Nay: (chuckles) Hellooo

Mark: And Frank is like, "Uh. Uh. Uh…" And they just ask for permission. "Will you?"

Michael: So if he had said, "No," they would be like, "Byeeee!"

Mark: Maybe?

Michael: Interesting

Mark: We'll never know because Frank is like…

Michael: (deep voice) "Yup!"

Mark: Frank says, "Show me." Do you want me to read to you just a little bit, of like, what…

Brennan: Yes

Mark: Okay. "They needed no further invitation to raise the curtain. He heard the door creak as it was opened, and turned to see that the world beyond the threshold had disappeared, to be replaced by the same panic-filled darkness from which the members of the order had stepped. He looked back towards the Cenobites, seeking some explanation for this, but they disappeared. Their passing had not gone unrecorded however, they had taken the flowers with them, leaving only bare boards, and on the wall the offerings he had assembled were blackening as if in the heat of some invisible flame. He smelled the bitterness of their consumption. It pricked his nostrils so acutely he was certain they would bleed. But the smell of burning was only the beginning. No sooner had he registered it then half-a-dozen other scents filled his head. Perfumes he had scarcely noticed until now were suddenly overpoweringly strong, the lingering scent of filch blossoms, the scent of paint on the ceiling and the sap on the wood beneath his feet all filled his head. He put a hand to his mouth and nose to stop the onslaught overcoming him, but the stench of perspiration on his fingers made him giddy. He might have been driven to nausea had there not been the fresh sensations flooding his system from each nerve ending and taste bud." Basically, the beginning of his experience with the Cenobites is every single sense going into fucking overdrive…

Michael: Right. Completely heightened

Mark: What's terrifying is that by the end of the chapter, when all of it (snaps fingers) just goes away and he thinks for two seconds, "Oh I'm dead, I don't exist anymore," that's essentially when the Engineer, who is like the Head Cenobite, shows up and is like, "Oh, you've woken up. Now we can begin." And it's like, "Oh, fuck!" So what I find fascinating is that in the movie, (Frank) is like, "Whoa, I unlocked the box!" And then it's like, "Surprise! Hooks!"

Nay: Right

Mark: And it's just like, "Here you go, you go to hell!" In the novella, there's consent. In both novella and film, Kirsty is not, they don't ask Kirsty for consent when she unlocks, and I'm just sort of like, I found the inclusion of consent in the novella fascinating. Does anyone have any thoughts about why Kirsty doesn't get that or…

Nay: I don't know

Mark: I know. It's like…

Michael: I mean, it's almost 'coz you want a quick answer from a man versus a woman, you know, I mean?

Nay: Yeah, maybe

Mark: Maybe they have a little more of a yen for a young gal like Kirsty, I dunno. And they were like, "Oh, Frank. Well…"

Michael: "You want to?"

Mark: "You really? I mean…"

Nay: Oh, Frank

Brennan: Frank's a dish, though

Michael: Yeah

Mark: (whispers) Oh my God! (normal voice) Did you know that original sex scene between him and Julia included spanking and anal sex?

Nay: Yes! I was reading about that

Mark: Yeah

Nay: I'm so sad all that had to get cut

Mark: Can you imagine

Michael: Did they film it?

Mark: Julia's just gettin' it in the butt, on her wedding dress, I mean…

Michael: I wish she had strapped one of those Dildo Nightmares on and given it to him

Nay: Yo. Right

Brennan: The one with the face on it?

Michael: Yeah

Mark: (British announcer voice) "Clive Barker's Dildo Nightmares."

Nay: I don't think Frank's a switch, though

Michael: You don't?

Nay: Mm-mmm. I really don't

Brennan: I think after he opens the box he probably is!

Mark: Yeah

Nay: Hmmmm

Mark: They make you be a switch, I guess!

Nay: Right. You doin' whatever they say, basically. But I don't know if Frank on his own-- I feel like the way Julia would just love to lay back on the bed, I'm like, "You're a little pillow princess bottom. And you ain't never been fucked like this before. You don't make yourself cum very well, so you are like hooked on this man." I feel really bad for straight women

Mark: I just love that moment when Julia opens the door in that flashback and she sees Frank. She has this sort of glazed look like she's a children's show host. She's just like, (chirpily as a children's show host)."Hello! Oh hi! Oh, you're Frank! Hi!"

Nay: Yo, those flashbacks be fuckin' her up

Mark: Like he literally…

Michael: They're amazing. I love that they felt the need to give her a different hairdo...

Mark: Yeah

Michael: And it was Weird Al. And like, she can keep the same hair, it wasn't that long ago

Mark: I thought more Richard Simmons, because it was rich red, and y'know

Michael: Love that she got fucked on her wedding dress, though

Mark: I mean, y'know, I think that's why Hellraiser always really resonated with me is the idea that it was-- it treated sex, not as a means for the monster to come get you, but rather sex played its own role. There's an elegance to the way sex is handled in the Hellraiser universe, or at least in the first film. Because it feels like sex doesn't really have as much-- and Part III, it kind of does, but it's so visceral and it's such a motivating factor

Michael: My thought during the movie was that Frank was poly. I actually was watching it, and I go, "He will have sex with anyone he finds attractive. He is definitely a queer character even though they're not saying it…"

Nay: We are not saying poly people just wanna have sex with everyone they're attracted to

Michael: Yeah. But, I guess, yeah, I put that poorly

Nay: But if he wasn't poly, he needed to be, otherwise he out here cheatin'

Michael: Yeah

Mark: Frank is an Eve figure, right? Frank is the one who's like, "I'm gonna pick the fruit from the Tree of Knowledge" kind of thing, and you know, knowing full well that he's going to unleash terrible terribleness in pursuit of pleasure. But what I love also, again, about Hellraiser is that it feels like there is no innocent victims in Hellraiser, like it's such a cynical movie about the characters, where like, Frank is not a victim. At all

Michael: No

Mark: Julia is definitely not a victim

Michael: No

Mark: Even Kirsty, who seems like the doofiest girl alive at the top, she's like, (doofy girl voice)."Hi Daddy! Whatever! I'm just boppin' around," (normal voice) you know, at that weird dinner scene with Chip, or what's-his-name?

Michael: Steven?

Mark: (as Kirsty's dad) "So lie down." (normal voice) I'm like, "Ew! God!"

Michael: But there's also an aspect, like Julia's not an innocent victim, but I, I was kind of rooting for her every single time 'coz I'm like, "These guys are dicks! They're pigs." Like the first guy she brings home, you know, is like, "This is what you brought me here for, isn't it? So let's get on with it. You change your fuckin' mind?" I'm like, "Kill him. Kill that motherfucker."

Nay: God. Right. Definitely

Michael: And the second guy essentially alludes…

Mark: (amused) I love that we're like, the guy was expecting sex. "We hate you! Kill him. Kill him!"

Nay: But I mean, to say it?

Michael: Yeah, it's one thing to expect sex, and then when you're not getting what you expect instead of just walking away and being fine with it, he's kind of like, "Fuck you!"

Mark: I know, it's true

Michael: "Give me what I came here for"?

Mark: Of course

Michael: And I'm like, "You came here to die, bitch."

Nay: Yeah

Mark: "You brought me to your scary sex-murder attic…"

Michael: "And I'm gonna sex-murder you." You're getting what you want. And then man-bait number two, he alludes to the fact, and this is the way I read it, when he's walking up the stairs and he just casually is like, "I like to be careful," as if he's saying she's some-- like there's something uncouth about her because she dares to be sexual, you know what I mean? By her bringing him home, he's essentially calling her quote-unquote "dirty", where it's like, he's involved in this process too, you know what I mean? So I'm like, "Kill him. Kill that fucker." Like he's totally shaming her in that one little line

Mark: Well, it's interesting because the more Julia-- the first time Julia brings a snack home for Frank, y'know, she's terrified

Michael: A Little Debbie?

Mark: Yeah. Exactly. "Postmates!" But that montage eventually, you know, I'm like, "Oh shit, six, seven, eight, I don't know how many randos she's brought home from that airport bar." She starts to look like she's like, "Oh, these guys are so gross, who gives a shit." I love how unrepentantly awful Julia is

Michael: It's pretty great

Mark: She's so-- there's like no redeeming qualities to Julia, not really

Michael: Well, the last guy's like, "I get lonely," and she's like, "Don't we all," and she's like, "Here, honey."

Mark: I take it back. It's not that there's no redeeming qualities, I think that it takes a certain level of love for her to...

Michael: Well, she says, "I'll do anything you want," you know?

Nay: Wow

Mark: Yeah

Nay: I ain't never felt like that, okay??

Michael and Mark: Right???

Nay: Yeah

Mark: "I need you to bring home rando businessmen…"

Michael: "I need skin. Bring me home skin. And blood."

Mark: That's…

Michael: While I was watching it, too, I was kinda thinking there's a cool version of this story too, where it's like vigilante Julia that they could do, if there was ever make-- in my head I was like, this is how I would pitch it, like, "Julia's this amazing badass who's taking out problematic people. And the spin on it would be that she's not actually doing it for Frank, she's doin' it for herself, and humanity." And so, I kinda love her for those little moments in this movie because you're kind of like, "Yeah, murder's bad," but at the same time it's like, "Is anyone gonna miss this rapist?" You know what I mean?

Brennan: It could be a crossover with Teeth

Nay: Mmmm. Nice

Michael: Yeah. Oh, maybe that's where Dawn is going at the end, she's going to Julia's hair salon…

Mark: So Dawn and Julia are gonna team up Thelma & Louise style to go...

Nay: Yesss

Michael: Julia works at a hair salon, she goes there, she says, "Give me the Chucky," and she gets the Chucky…

Mark: There you go

Michael: Hmmmm

Brennan: Is this our flashback episode?

Michael: We're just combining as many of our episodes as we can

Mark: It's a grab bag!

Michael: Speaking of the score from earlier, I wish I would've, I meant to tell you to grab this-- I love, (whispers) "Julia Julia Julia Julia…" (normal voice) Did you notice that? Like have you noticed that? I watched it with headphones on

Mark: Oh see, I did not

Michael: And every time Julia goes near that attic, you hear, (whispers) "Julia Julia Julia Julia…"

Mark: Ohhh!

Michael: And it sounds like it's accompanied by the music, so I took it as actually part of the score…

Mark: I didn't-- I never heard that

Michael: Granted, she's hearing it too. It is so amazing, and it happens every single time she goes in the attic, and as the movie progresses, it happens every single time she brings a guy home…

Mark: Wow, okay

Michael: It's almost like, I took it as the first few times, it's her hearing this. And then after Frank reemerges, after his body's starting to be reformed, I take it as she's hearing this from Frank, and by the end of the movie I feel like she's hearing it from either Pinhead or the Cenobites or hell. So it's a really cool progression that obviously, I don't think you clearly don't hear, unless you have headphones in and you're blaring the movie, so it's really subtle, so check it out next time you're watching it

Nay: I watch everything with captions on, so I didn't hear it

Mark: Yeah

Nay: But I read it

Michael: It did play on-- oh, great!

Nay: Yeah

Michael: Did you have any thoughts on that or were you just kind of-- I really enjoyed it 'coz A) it's just a cool thing…

Nay: Yeah

Michael: But, it progresses with the movie when you hear it

Nay: Yeah, I don't think I've ever-- yeah, I definitely didn't notice that

Mark: I wanna talk about the Cenobites a little bit, because they're clearly based on, in terms of the way they're designed by Clive Barker, and BDSM looks that we see in the works of Mapplethorpe and Wigler

Brennan: (laughs) Sorry. Never heard that name before

Mark: Jim Wigler? Yeah, he's a great photographer. Clearly coded as a queer menace that can disrupt the family structure, and y'know, for anyone who has any kind of feeling about the kink community, Pinhead says, "Angels to some, demons to others." And while I think overall story wise there's a kind of Buddhist approach to what brings the suffering, what do you guys think? Beyond Barker's well-publicized interest in the fetish community, what do you guys think is behind the choice to lean into the sort of Tom of Finland gone berserk look of the Cenobites? Why that specifically?

Michael: Is that in the novella? Is it described…

Mark: Yeah, it's described pretty graphically how they're fitted, the leather, they're pierced and I remember he told his costume designer "repulsive glamour" was what they needed to go for

Michael: So great

Mark: Yeah, the fact that skin and leather was actually going to be interwoven, that they were one and the same with what they wore. "You are what you wear," as it were. And, I dunno, I just wanted to know what you guys thought about what was behind that specific look that up until that point had been popularized by Freddy Mercury to a certain degree and became the sort of look of the "threatening" homosexual, kind of, you know? Especially in the age of AIDS, especially?

Michael: I'm laughing but I am

Mark: Is it Clive Barker just literally flipping the bird to a straight audience, saying, "Yeah, we scare you? Great."

Nay: I hope so

Mark: Or is it something else?

Michael: I mean, yeah, right?

Nay: Yeah. I mean it is super scary to people, so

Mark: Well, they're very unsettling

Nay: Yeah

Mark: They're so unsettling to look at

Michael: They are. But it's also like, again, to me, it's like a cross. It's like scary and erotic at the same time

Nay: Huh

Mark: Completely

Michael: And those two things do go hand in hand, y'know? It also may just be what Clive's into, y'know? People put their own kink into everything…

Brennan: They really do

Michael: You know? Stuff I write and do, I put stuff that I'm really into it and it's like..

Brennan: I was gonna say

Nay: I was gonna ask, "So what would be in your Hellraiser?"

Michael: Oh, girl

Mark: Is that why someone sits in a cake in every script you write?

Michael: "Is that why someone's always in a jockstrap?" Um, so there you go, jockstraps. Yeah

Mark: I love-- I mean, Clive Barker hates the name "Pinhead", he always wanted to call him "Hell Priest" in subsequent…

Michael: Oh, I love that, too!

Mark: In Scarlet Gospels, I think he returned to calling him Hell Priest, but I love, love love Pinhead, y'know, especially in the Eighties because he was such a departure from movie villains, he was so articulate and so refined. And there's such an economy of movement…

Michael: And like, calm

Mark: There's such an economy of movement and grace, that's sort of neutral. He doesn't go around chopping people up, he's summoned, you know? It was like a throwback to Bela Lugosi in Dracula (1931) in the sense that there's a kind of romantic grace and panache to Pinhead and his entourage. Well, I mean at least the female, I dunno about Chatterbox and Butterball, but like their actual names…

Nay: I mean, they got some swag! You know what I mean?

Mark: Listen, they got some sartorial choices going on, and I salute it. But sometimes I think the queerest thing about Hellraiser is the fact that Pinhead communicates in ways that transcend the punchline, and he's a monster, for at least over the course of the first two movies, he actually feels. Hellbound has problems in terms of story, in terms of, you know, Hellraiser II is all over the place, but it also goes for broke in ways that are just so, so repugnant and so upsetting and so terrifying. But also, so much of it has to do with the fact that all the Cenobites used to be human, and at least in the end of the film it is about Pinhead having to reckon with the fact that he was not always this thing that was seeking pleasure and became like this, you know, merchant of pain, but rather a person who just wanted to numb pain, or find any way to escape drudgery. And I dunno, I just feel that's what I find fascinating about Hellraiser is that it's so sympathetic to its monsters in terms of the first two movies, anyway. Hellraiser Part III is fun...

Michael: Hellraiser III is something

Mark: It's something else. But in terms of honoring what Clive Barker wants to do with monsters? It's trash, in my opinion. I dunno, come at me? I dunno…

Michael: Well, there's a way to look at Hell Priest, because I'm actually digging that so much more than Pinhead…

Nay: Oh my God, so into that

Michael: There's a way to look at the character as the most noble character in the film in a lot of ways. Cool, calm, collected, A). B) There's no bullshit

Mark: No!

Michael: What you see is what you get. What he tells you is the truth. He's, you know, like you said, he's like, "You brought me here, so now this is what's gonna happen," you know what I mean? For lack of a better term, he's the only honest character at the end of the day in the film, 'coz all the adult humans are shitty in one form or another at one time or another, including Kirsty

Mark: Maybe that's why Frank initially in the novella gets like, "Okay, do you wanna come or no? Was this a mistake? Did you change your mind?" But by the time Kirsty rings 'em, they show up, they're in an attic…

Nay: "We already know…"

Mark: They're like, "Ugh, for fuck's sake, you people again. All right."

Michael: He even offers Kirsty a deal, he doesn't have to do that

Mark: Kirsty is the one to offer the deal.

Michael: And he accepts it

Mark: She's the one who barters it, and that's when Kirsty actually becomes interesting to me. Up until that point she's like, (high-pitched girly voice) "Oh my God!"

Michael: She's like in a shampoo commercial up until this point?

Mark: Yeah, I mean, God bless Ashley Laurence, but you know, Kirsty is not…

Michael: Yeah!

Mark: Terribly fascinating

Michael: She's not fully-- I love this movie, but she's not very, she's a footstool up until that point

Mark: Exactly. Until she summons these, you know, sadomasochists from beyond the grave, which, you know, I think that was Clive Barker's original title for the movie

Michael: Oh my God!

Nay: Oh yeah, I bet-- that's so, yeah

Michael: Can we go back and make all this a thing?

Mark: But you know, when she willingly offers up a trade…

Michael: Uncle Frank?

Mark: I mean, that's, I was like, "Okay, wow. Kirsty's got a lot more going on." And she certainly has a lot more going on in Hellraiser II, where, look. the movie's a mess. It starts off, (as Kirsty) "I have to save my Daddy from hell!" (normal voice) And by the end she's just like, (as Kirsty) "My Dad, I forgot! Oh, well!" (normal voice) It's sort of, y'know, anywho

Nay: I have a question for people with dads. Did y'all call him, "Daddy"?

Michael: No

Nay: Ever? And then at what age did you stop? I'm not judging, I'm just curious.

Michael: Zero. Age zero

Mark: Nope

Nay: Okay

Brennan: No

Nay: Just wondering

Brennan: But it's important to remember that…

Michael: No Daddy-shaming

Nay: Damn, y'all got Dads? The fuck? Have had dads?

Michael: Mine's dead (laughs)

Brennan: It's important to remember that we were all raised male, and like gendered male, and that's kind of a different thing

Nay: Oh, I guess that's true

Brennan: I feel like there's daughter idea, which is where that word tends to come from more…

Nay: That makes sense

Brennan: In my personal experience

Mark: Yeah

Michael: But Frank's not her dad, either

Nay: Right

Michael: It's like, "That's her uncle." Does she call her dad "Daddy"? I didn't notice that

Nay: Yeah

Mark: Yeah, she does

Michael: Oh, 'coz I'm still stuck on Frank saying, "Come to Daddy," to everyone

Nay: *You* are stuck on Frank

Michael: *Mmm-hmm* You get to see some of Frank's "D"!

Nay: (laughing) Okay

Mark: Listen, Frank is freaky…

Nay: Frank's a freak fo' sho'

Mark: And yeah, super-freaky

Michael: Putting out a cigarette on my chest

Nay: Who freakier than Frank?

Mark and Nay: Nobody

Michael: He puts out a Virginia Slim out on me and I'm like, "That's vanilla."

Nay: That's vanilla, to Frank

Michael: For Frank

Mark: That's a Tuesday, for Frank

Nay: He's like...

Mark: Frank's like, "Yawn."

Michael: He's like, "I literally thought you were an ashtray."

Nay: Yeah. Hot

Mark: I mean, I do find it fascinating that Frank and Larry, who's called "Rory" in the novella, but Rory I think is not such a good name to yell out a lot

Michael: Larry's such a…

Nay: Uch, fuckin' hate Larry

Michael: Yeah. If I was Julia, I'd be getting Larry's brother's "D" too

Mark: Poor Larry

Michael: So boring

Mark: Larry can't catch a break. I think Larry is the only innocent victim in the Hellraiser story, like this poor sap. Oh my God. He can really pick 'em, oh my God, Julia

Nay: You know, this is the thing why if it was my movie, there wouldn't be a movie because the *moment* I saw my husband walking around with a dripping, bloody hand, "Why are-- you just lettin' that drip everywhere? Get the fuck outta my house! You move me into this pig pen with maggots and all this other shit, and now you think you can just walk around with your limbs bleeding, what the fuck is wrong with you?"

Mark: Can we just talk about the very first thing when they arrive, the *contempt* that Julia is dripping with, and he's like, "Please, let's just give it a chance."

Michael: Sourpuss face

Mark: And she's like, "All right."

Nay: Oooh, that's mean

Mark: And she puts out a cigarette *on the ground*

Nay: Might as well!

Mark: But like on the floor. Imagine, imagine doing that to somebody

Nay: Yo

Michael: I kind of love that she's like, (deep voice) "You brought me to this fuckin' house."

Nay: For real, that is…

Michael: He's like, (chipper) "It's gonna be great!"

Mark: Awww

Nay: No, ooof. I love being mean when my expectations aren't met, and everybody knows it, okay? So, oooh, I would love to put a cigarette out on nasty-ass fucking floor

(Brennan plays a clip from the movie)

Mover: Is that your daughter?

Larry: Uh-huh

Mover: She's got her mother's looks

Larry: Her mother's dead

Mover: Oh

Michael: Like okay, I'm with Larry there. I love that he's just like, "Mom's dead, dick." I love the other guy just being like, "Oh."

Nay: "Oh."

Mark: (as the mover) "Perhaps I should move in this furniture faster."

Michael: (as the mover) "Maybe I'll stop drinking this beer and continue moving your furniture."

Mark: Did you guys know that the role of Hell Priest, Pinhead, whatever, I feel like we're pretentious if we call him "Hell Priest", but whatever

Michael: No, we're cool

Nay: Yeah

Mark: Doug Bradley and the guy who played that mover were competing over who gets to play the part of the mover

Nay: Wild

Michael: Oh my God! Did the mover wanna play the mover?

Mark: Uh, yes. And Doug Bradley also wanted to play the mover *because* they were both acting, they were both early on in their careers and they were like, "Ugh, I don't wanna play this fucking guy with nails in his head. I wanna have a reel. I have to have my face visible so I'm cast-able."

Michael: He gives a great performance

Mark: It's a...

Michael: It's hard to do

Mark: I think it's wonderful. I think it's a wonderful performance

Nay: Yeah

Mark: He's chilling and terrifying, but also of course it made his career, and you know…

Michael: I sort of love that Hell Priest is a little androgynous, too, y'know?

Mark: Oh, completely

Michael: And I love that there's little vaginas all over. Did anyone else notice that?

Nay: No, I did not

Michael: Like on the Cenobites, they all have a vagina, they all have what looks like a vagina somewhere on their body

Mark: Well, you know, the female (Cenobite) has a vagina neck, essentially

Michael: I believe Pin-- Hell Priest has one in his torso

Mark: Mmm-hmm

Michael: And then I started spotting them on all the Cenobites and I had never noticed that before

Nay: That's a good point

Mark: I know, it's like a Where's Waldo? of vaginas in Hellraiser

Michael: Yeah, and it's just so…

Nay: That's so fun

Mark: Once you see them

Michael: It's just so fun, and it's like, once again, Clive Barker as a queer person himself, it just adds to the queerness of the movie to me

Nay: Could you imagine getting your neck fucked?

Michael: (sighs orgasmically)

Nay: (exasperated) Okay, Michael… (as Michael) "Ahhhhhh!" (normal voice) I mean, imagine. Maybe you have.

Mark: Can you imagine?

Michael: I feel like, remove my neck

Mark: If you remade me, I guess I could

Michael: Is it on the side, is it up here?

Mark: The Scarlet Gospels I have not read, but I really want to read, from a couple years ago, where it was (Clive Barker's) continuation of the story of Hell Priest

Nay: Wow

Michael: Oh, okay

Mark: Which is that all the magicians in the world, there's very few left, are being murdered one by one by Hell Priest because he wants to collect their magic for himself…

Brennan: Lance Burton, Criss Angel…

Michael: Mindfreak!

Mark: David Copperfield… because Hell Priest wants to get together all their magic so that he can take on Lucifer in hell

Nay: Oh, damn, Hell Priest

Michael: That's so cool

Mark: And change the landscape of hell, and so basically, one of the surviving magician-- I'm probably fucking up this synopsis, but I'm very excited to read it because I just haven't…

Michael: You're doing such a good job, though. Anyway. I feel like this has happened before

Mark: Anyway, long story short, Hell Priest-- but again, it goes back to the idea of Hell Priest having a purpose for humanity, and by Part III, that was just sort of abandoned, and by (Hellraiser) Part VIII, he was like, "I just like slappin' bitches…"

Nay: Oh, Lord

Michael: And Part III is essentially as close to like a teeny slasher as you can get in a lot of ways

Mark: And it's fun

Michael: It's fun!

Mark: It's got a lot of fun stuff in it

Michael: It's got a guy with his boxer briefs up to his nipples, it's great

Mark: Oh, my God. JP Monroe? JP Monroe, club impresario?

Michael: I'm so here for this

Mark: Oh my God

Michael: And he gave himself a yeast infection

Nay: (annoyed) Okay…

Mark: Anywho…

Nay: (sotto voce) I swear to God…

Michael: But in (Hellraiser) Part Two, I love the fact that they initially wanted him to be Hell Priest, because there's a lot of religious imagery all over, and just nuns walking by and little statues and stuff, so that's really cool to know, 'cause that's totally on purpose. That's connected to what (Clive Barker) originally wanted to call Pinhead

Mark: No, absolutely. As a high priest of hell

Michael: And speaking of the nuns, can someone explain to me, because every time I've watched this I've kind of had, soon after seeing the nuns I've had, not confusion but not fully understanding A.) Why (Kirsty) passes out in that moment, and B.) Why she ends up in a psych ward type hospital. Every time I watch, I'm like, "What the fuck is this hospital?"

Mark: Well, she's basically unharmed but covered in blood…

Michael: True. Okay...

Mark: So, it's kind of a stretch that she'd end up in a psych ward and not just in a drunk tank? Or something?

Michael: I don't know if it's just how they treat her, or like, yeah, the ER to check to see if the blood is coming from her own body

Nay: Right

Mark: Listen, okay. Hellraiser has some moments where you ask questions like that and my response would be, "Shhhh. (whispers) You're gonna miss this next part that's really great!"

Michael: Yeah, I just-- this time watching it I was like, "What's with this hospital?"

Mark: Yeah, no, listen. Even Clive Barker, he's like, "Mostly I'm not embarrassed by the movie," but he's very critical of his own work, and…

Michael: But I kind of buy it, because then it kind of allows for her to have her wall open up and there be a pathway to hell without her being interrupted because they're like, "Eh, we're just gonna leave you over here in this corner."

Mark: Yeah, listen. She had to be alone in order to have that moment, okay?

Nay: Yeah, right right

Michael: "Stop following me, Dad. Daddy."

Nay: "Daddy." Ooooh

Mark: It also leads to that immortal moment of when she bargains for her own soul and (Hell Priest's) like, "If you show up, maybe, maybe." I love it. And then, "We'll tear your soul apart. (deep voice) We'll tear your hole apart!" Anyway

Michael: I love that whole thing

Nay: "Your hole apart"? Wow

Mark: Yeah, I mean, you know that's what they mean

Nay: And that's fine.

Nay: Hell Priest is like the delicious dom top I want to be when I grow up. You're like honest, frightening, it's perfect

Mark: Calm

Nay: Calm

Mark: There's no...

Nay: You float...

Michael: Sexy…

Nay: You float, you don't walk. Yeah. That sounds good

Michael: Mrs. Danvers's brother

Nay: Oh, okay. Same outfit, just about

Michael: He even holds his hands like her

Nay: Mmm-hmm!

Mark: That's true

Nay: I want that shared universe

Mark: I think, I agree. I do think Mrs. Danvers and Hell Priest share one parent, clearly. They're like step-siblings

Nay: Ooooh, I live, I live!

Michael: Or they're lovers separated by decades and generations

Mark: And wardrobe?

Mark: What I love about Hellraiser is that like we talked about before, if we're asserting, if Barker's asserting that the need for pleasure or validation leads to suffering, you know, when you watch people playing with the box, the Lament Configuration, the way they touch it and caress it…

Michael: The way little sperms fly off of it, did you notice that?

Mark: Well, once you know… I couldn't stop thinking about iPhones. I could not stop thinking about phones, and there was a part of me watching Hellraiser this time around where I was like, "God! This movie's visionary and prescient in *so* many ways." But at the same time there was like, "I can't think of an inanimate object I fondle on a day-to-day basis more than my fucking phone that I fucking hate." And, it always-- every time I go to the phone, it is in some way shape or form, many times, for validation or mindless pleasure, and a lot of the time it leads to fucking suffering. Or…

Michael: (fey voice) Twitter?

Nay: Right

Mark: Yeah, Twitter for one

Nay: That's a cursed app

Mark: And I just was like, "Is the hellscape of social media in a way a kind of terrain of suffering-slash-pleasure?"

Michael: Absolutely

Mark: That we can't differentiate. Like there's no hooks, but I just couldn't stop thinking about it this past time

Michael: Well, it's interesting that you bring that up, because I mean it kinda is. There's plenty of people-- I mean, I know I've been there in the past, and I've actually had to take a long social media break in the past for like, my frickin' sanity. But just go on it, you can find one or two people every single day who are clearly doing it to themselves. They're deriving pleasure from it, but they're also being completely affected by all the negative aspects of social media, and it's clearly hurting them

Mark: Doubtlessly

Michael: And then they continue to go back

Mark: Yeah

Michael: You know?

Mark: Oh, I post something to Instagram, some little random doodad video or whatever, and some days I'll catch myself and I'll be like, "Why do I give a fuck if anybody fucking likes this? I'm forty years old!"

Michael: Your videos are always so funny though, and I love figuring them out

Mark: "What the fuck is wrong with me that I fucking give a shit? Go work, Mark! Go to work!"

Michael: Another ringtone

Mark: And it ends up creating an echo chamber of suffering as a result, because I just end up feeling stupid and embarrassed

Michael: Well, you go for the immediate pleasure and you end up getting the pain

Mark: Yes! So, I dunno. I think that we have…

Michael: Hmmm, Hellraiser film, cell phone…

Mark: The box, we all have the box

Michael: It's a box

Nay: Yeah

Mark: And you might be listening to this podcast via your own Lament Configuration box [EN: I sure am!]

Michael: Just don't stop, okay?

Nay: Yeah, right?

Mark: (faux chipper) Anyway, that's the show!

Michael: It's a bit nuts. It's very valid

Mark: I dunno

Michael: Nay?

Nay: I mean, every time I heard, "The box", I didn't think of a phone, but that's just me!

Mark: What did you think of?

Nay: Uh, pussy

Mark: Yeah

Nay: Yeah, okay (inaudible)

Mark: (deep voice) I wanna hear you say it!

Michael: But you actually derive posture pleasure from your phone

Mark: Yeah

Nay: (scoffs) Yeah

Mark: Art and commerce and...

Nay: That's my best friend, that's my best friend

Michael: Yeah

Nay: But. There are definitely moments of suffering, you know?

Mark: But I think you work your Lament Configuration better than I do, clearly

Michael: You work it very well

Nay: I hear you. When you were talking I was thinking about how if a post doesn't do as well as something else, you're like, "Is it the algorithm? Did I not hashtag this? Was it like it's not a selfie, was it a group photo," or whatever the case maybe be, and it *can* feel like, "Bitch, who the fuck cares?"

Mark: And then Pinhead's standing over your shoulder going like…

Nay: "Scroll, scroll!"

Michael: "Post another one!"

Mark: (as Pinhead) "You misused your hashtags! You posted at the wrong time of day!!"

Michael: (as Pinhead) "Can we now go look at Dildo Nightmares?"

Nay: Exactly

Mark: Yes. (as Pinhead) "Maybe. Maybe."

Michael: (as Pinhead) "Maybe. Follow them, Nay?"

Nay: Yes, I do

Michael: Oh, I wanna do Hellraiser voice

Mark: (as Pinhead) "No likes, please."

Brennan: (as Pinhead) "Re-tweet if you agree."

Mark: "Like and subscribe!"

Michael: (as Pinhead) "Bummer! No one likes my pins."

Brennan: Oh, he totally has a Pinterest!

Mark: (as Pinhead) "You can find me on Pinterest!" (normal voice). No, but I mean, I really do…

Michael: He's looking at like, cute suits with no socks and stuff

Mark: If, as Barker describes hell, if Barker is presenting hell as a place where pleasure can be achieved if you're willing to go through an enormous amount of…

Michael: Pain

Mark: Amount of pain. That you can transcend pain into pleasure. Then I just go, "The internet. The internet."

Michael: Right.

Mark: It's just… I dunno

Nay: Yeah. Yeah.

Michael: You know what I mean? Is what Pinhead offering any worse than what people are already living? In a lot of ways? No.

Mark: Well, I mean, there's hooks

Michael: Yeah

Nay: Jesus wept

Mark: Jesus wept. Oh, man

Michael: So great

Mark: The original line Frank was going to say was, "Fuck off." And then I think Barker said the actor improvised it?

Michael: Oh!

Nay: "Jesus wept", that's what you're gonna say? Huh.

Mark: Andrew Lawrence improvised it and it's one of the most legendary moments in the movie. I mean, it's just-- I'll never forget the first time I saw it, I was like, "Oh. Okay, I don't even know."

Michael: Can we talk about all the different people that played Frank essentially? Because you have the guy that played Larry played Frank, and then you had Sean Chapman who played Frank, and then you had skinless Frank, who was played by another actor…

Mark: Oliver something

Michael: And I believe there was a fourth, a voice possibly, like a third or fourth, so essentially three people. Whose voice did they use?

Mark: Good question

Michael: 'Coz the original Frank was clearly dubbed…

Nay: Yeah

Mark: Yeah. He was. They kept Julia British because you know, evil stepmother, you know

Michael: But Steve was dubbed, too, Kirsty's boyfriend

Mark: Is that his name? I was calling him "Chip".

Michael: But at the end, it felt like the guy, Larry, what's that actor's name?

Mark: Andrew Lawrence, I believe. Maybe I'm having a brain fart

Michael: Yes, that was playing Frank at the end, that sounded like-- I'm just curious because it's interesting that three different actors essentially played one character

Mark: Andrew Robinson! It's Ashley Laurence, Andrew Robinson, my bad

Michael: There's one voice throughout the movie

Mark: Right

Michael: I just thought it was an interesting question to ask

Mark: I mean…

Michael: But the first time watching it, and Sean Chapman's version of Frank started speaking, I had to rewind it like five or six times. I'm like, "Is there something wrong with my audio sync going on right now?"

Mark: I think you can look at the different versions of Frank, versions and the different numbers of actors or voices or personas that Frank takes on throughout the film in the first and second one is that, you know, Barker is interested in our shadow selves and sort of you know, the sort of face we present to the world, like for Julia the face she presents to her husband and the face she presents to her stepdaughter is vastly different than the one she hides and shows to Frank, and the one she hides and shows to the sort of blood bags that she picks up at the airport.

Nay: Blood bags. Okay?

Mark: I always think of it as an airport bar.

Nay: Where she hammers 'em

Mark: She hammers 'em!

Michael: Back in the Eighties when people would literally go hang out at the airport bar?

Mark: That's true. They would, wouldn't they?

Nay: Yeah

Michael: "Honey, wanna go grab a drink at the airport bar?"

Mark: Sex at the HoJo?

Michael: "Maybe we can watch the American Airlines flights take off while we sip a martini."

Mark: Ahh, foreplay

Nay: Back when you could go to the gate without a ticket?

Michael: Back when I was in high school, I used to get high and go to the observation deck at the airport and just watch planes take off and be like, "Uh!" for hours with my friends

Nay: That sounds bomb

Michael: Isn't that amazing? And then something happened when I got into college and I could not handle weed at all, like I would just freak the fuck out

Mark: Yeah, I think...

Nay: Sounds like the wrong strain, but that's okay

Michael: No, that stayed with me until I got sober, so anyway.

Mark: Understandable

Nay: Yeah

Michael: High plane watching

Mark: I dunno guys, I love this movie so much. It's dirty, it pushes all of my nuclear family run amok buttons...

Michael: Absolutely

Mark: And when I was a little kid, it just made me feel sexy and dirty and frightened and...

Michael: It makes blood look so hot

Nay: Yeah

Michael: I love the dripping blood, and the blood that (Frank) runs on (Julia's) face is just so sexy, and like the blood in the IV bag, how it shoots up (groans orgasmically) Gimme it

Mark: To use that much blood in a mainstream film, in 1987, especially as a gay auteur at that time is a statement

Nay: Hell yeah

Michael: Absolutely

Mark: That is a statement

Michael: "I'm gonna take one of the things you're fucking terrified of and just confront you with it for ninety minutes. Make you confront it."

Mark: Listeners who listened to our episode on Fright Night certainly got a real rundown of a lot of AIDS-related stats from 1985, and by 1987, not a whole lot had fucking changed in terms of how the culture approached AIDS and HIV…

Michael: I love how one person can make you change the way you look at a movie. 'Cause until Bryan came in, I'd thought about it, but never that much, like what you're talking about right now

Mark: Bryan was disappointed-- and you know, it's interesting to bring up in the context of Hellraiser too, in terms of the constant use of blood and the constant use of the way, if you know about the Lament Configuration box, if you know about this version of hell, it's like a contamination, it is like a disease, you can't let it go. Once Julia knows, she can't un-know it, and suddenly she's spreading this sort of death and destruction around herself, but Bryan, the day after we recorded the pod, he was like, "Ahhh! I'm so mad!" I was like, "Why?" And he was like, "I wanted to talk about bugchasing…"

Michael: That's what he said?

Mark: "Bugchasing in Fright Night." And it's interesting to think about it in terms of Hellraiser as well, you know-- Frank is, the people who find the box, they seek it out, because they think they've gone to the limits, they think they've experienced everything there is to experience, and all they feel now is numbness or a kind of, sort of anomie for day-to-day life. They want to go to the far reaches of exploratory sadomasochism. And it's interesting to look at that, especially in the context of conservative America at the time certainly looked at AIDS as something you sought out, and you "deserved it". You got it, "because you sought it out, because you went and did those sex things."

Michael: When you got it, a lot of people in the time thought you got it because God's giving it to you because of what you chose then

Mark: Right

Michael: Like you didn't even seek it out, you were given it because you deserve to be handed it, y'know

Mark: Right. So it's interesting the way Hellraiser, and to a degree, Fright Night, turns those ideas on their head a little bit

Michael: And they came out the same year, '87

Mark: Uhhh, Fright Night was '85

Michael: Was it '85?

Mark: Yes

Michael: I'm thinking of Nightmare 3

Mark: Oh, Nightmare 3. So good

Michael: I know, it's so great

Mark: Is it just me, or does Julia's hair get bigger with every murder she commits?

Michael: Absolutely

Nay: Oh, yeah. I'm like, "Is the blood feeding you, too?"

Mark: Goddammit, it's a perfect movie

Michael: He drinks the blood and she eats the hair. It just like, grows

Mark: Teasing it out. Bigger, higher and higher!

Michael: Girl loves her White Rain

Nay: Yeah, I mean, she feeling herself by the second kill, she's like, "Imma put on this beautiful white blouse…"

Mark: (sings) "Finally!"

Nay: (joins in) "It has happened to me, right in front of my face and I just cannot hide it!"

Michael: (sings) "Ooooohhhh!"

Mark and Nay: (sings) "Finally! You came along, the way you…"

Nay: I don't know the words

Mark: (sings) "If you only knew the men I just killed for you…" (normal voice) Anyway

Michael: (sings) "For dick!"

Michael: Cherry Falls is a great movie, I just bought that on Blu-ray

Brennan: Oh yeah, it was a blast

Michael: I also got Valentine on Blu-ray, too. I said, "Fuck it."

Brennan: To David Boreanaz?

Michael: He is a terrible actor anyway

Brennan: "I asked him to have shoulders, not to act!"

Mark: Social media as I stated before is a hellscape of pain and suffering, so I'm suddenly rethinking my entire approach

Michael: So yeah, give Mark's Instagram account a look..

Mark: Or don't! I dunno! Don't feed my late-blooming addiction

Nay: Feed mine! Yeah, you can feed mine, that's fine

Brennan: Oh yeah, Nay is an Instagram genius

Nay: Oh!

Michael: You really are

Mark: She's really good

Nay: That's so sweet

Michael: I don't have an Instagram account but I will literally "w-w-w-dot…"

Nay: On desktop? To watch my Instagram stories?

Michael: "Why won't it scroll? Why won't it scroll?"

Mark: (as Hell Priest) "We'll tear your hole apart!"

Michael: (as Hell Priest) "Tear your hole apart! Jesus wept."

Nay: If you agree

Mark: If you consent

Nay: Yeah

Mark: If you consent

Michael: Consensual tearing apart only

Mark: See, that's why I love the Cenobites in the book, 'coz they were like...

Nay: Ceno-byeeeeee!!

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